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A Comprehensive (?) Guide to Universalism Apologetics

2020.09.22 19:53 Ephezius A Comprehensive (?) Guide to Universalism Apologetics

In response to a request from u/jatecaom, I have listed my thoughts around how I defend my Universalist viewpoints with my Christian brothers and sisters who disagree with me. I thought I’d post it here instead of in the original post, in case anyone else finds this valuable.
I apologize upfront for the length of this post, but I wanted to be as comprehensive as possible. To help you read through it all, I have broken this out into sections. Just find the section you need and go for it. Also, I'm certainly not the authority on this topic, so add something if I have any glaring omissions!
SECTIONS
1.) Approach, intentionality, and being selectively definitive
2.) Assumptions
3.) Apologetics is Chess
4.) Going on the offensive
a. Philosophy and Reason
b. Verses
5.) Defend yourself!
a. Common pushback
b. Verses that seem to contradict
6.) Supporting verses
SECTION 1: APPROACH, INTENTIONALITY, AND BEING SELECTIVELY DEFINITIVE
This probably goes without saying, but I think the most important thing here is to approach anyone with an attitude of love. Imagine if they actually start to believe what you’re saying. The amount of hope they will experience is immeasurable, as you probably know if you’re reading this. Just knowing that everything really will be alright in the end is the truest “good news” we can share. I believe this message can be incredibly edifying to the church, so my encouragement to you is to shy away from an, “I am right and you are wrong” conversation. Everyone innately believes that they are right; seldom few are able to have an open heart to consider a different belief system. Only the Holy Spirit can prepare a heart for a change of this magnitude, as most Christians haven’t even heard of Christian Universalism.
I’d also add that you need to be strong in your faith before you engage in apologetics. If you are easily swayed, or if you don’t yet know why you believe Universalism, then it’s probably best to walk away from the conversation.
Finally, be okay with saying “I don’t know.” None of us – regardless of belief system – every have all the answers. Only be definitive when you know in your heart that something is true. If someone asks you if Judas is in Hell and you aren’t sure… say that you aren’t sure. That’s okay. Only say something if you can prove it through reason or text.
In today’s polarizing environment, it’s important to remember that having differing opinions is a wonderful thing. It can be fun to engage in these debates! As long as you respect people for what they believe and that they have a right to believe it, they will probably reciprocate.
Okay… enough preamble. Let’s get into it!
SECTION 2: ASSUMPTIONS
Let me start by putting out the assumptions I’m operating under. This topic is apologetics vs. witnessing to someone who may be an atheist, agnostic, or from another religion, so I am assuming that the audience to whom we are defending our faith is Christian.
Second, I assume that they have some level of believing in the authority of scripture, though I do have several reason-based arguments if they do not.
Next, I’m operating under the assumption that the Bible is infallible, but not necessarily literal. A lot of people immediately conclude that you don’t believe in the authority of the scripture if you believe in Universalism. That’s just not true.
Finally, my personal opinions on some specific aspects of Universalism are likely different from others on this channel. I’m sure you’ll disagree with some of my responses, but hopefully some of this will help.
SECTION 3: APOLOGETICS IS A GAME OF CHESS
When you’ve had enough of these debates, you come to realize that there is always a pattern. You must be ready in and out of season, as it were (II Tim 4:2) – you never know when one of these topics will come up.
I’ve found most often that when you pronounce your faith in Universalism, the audience tends to bombard you with questions about this verse and that verse. You’ll find yourself very quickly in a defensive posture. I follow a few rules:
1.) I never bring it up unless I’m asked
2.) I always let them ask the first question, which is usually “why do you believe this?”
3.) I typically answer with a “why do you not believe in Universalism?”
4.) If asked earnestly, they will enumerate all of the issues you’re going to have to address. This is your roadmap
5.) I never assume I’m going to convince anyone. You can give the best, most eloquent defense of your position and – at best – you’ll give someone pause
6.) Always be thinking 3-4 questions in advance. If they are on a certain line of questioning, then you can probably anticipate what’s coming next. Be ready to give them some thought-provoking questions of your own
7.) Generally, I usually answer a question with another question
SECTION 4: GOING ON THE OFFENSIVE
Philosophy and Reason
As I said in a previous response, I typically open with this logic:
Only two of the following three statements can be true:
1.) God is Love 2.) God is omnipotent 3.) Some people go to Hell for eternal torment
So in other words, if people will end up in hell, that means that He is either not Love or He does not have the ability to save all. Anyone with a slight belief in the Bible will know that it specifically declares that God is Love and that He is all powerful.
Beyond that, I like to start with philosophical questions:
1.) How can you reconcile the statement “God is Love” with “eternal torment”? Especially for benign individuals like American Indians living in 1,000 AD who never heard of Christ?
Why would God resurrect unbelievers to everlasting torment if He could just let them ‘sleep’?
Why would God create someone when He knew they were destined for eternal torment? Even if it’s their choice, wouldn’t a loving God see that non-creation is a better alternative?
2.) If through the sin of Adam – a created being – all men were doomed to eternal torment, how is the sacrifice of Christ – God himself – not enough to save everyone?
3.) How can we be happy in heaven knowing that those we love – and those God still loves – are being tormented beyond comprehension during every moment for the rest of all eternity? God did say that He will “wipe away our tears” (Rev. 21:4).
4.) Is God not powerful enough to stop eternal torment? If He is powerful enough, does He just not want to? Is Satan God’s equal in this matter?
5.) What do you do with the term “all” in the litany of verses in the Bible that explicitly say all will be saved? If you look to the original languages ‘all’ actually means ‘all’. In fact, the term ‘the many’ means ‘all’ as well (Matt. 20:28  I Tim. 2:6, Rom. 5:18).
6.) If man is helpless to save himself (Rom. 5:6), dead in sin (Eph. 2:1), and can’t understand spiritual things in the first place (I Cor. 2:14), then faith is a gift from God and not of man (Eph. 2:8-9, Phil. 1:29). How then is eternal torment fair? Is God a God of fairness?
7.) Did Jesus do all of the work of salvation, or did He leave us to do some of it? In other words, how are we saved?
Is it belief alone (Eph. 2:8-9)? Is it belief and confession (Rom. 10:9)? Do we have to apologize for our sins (Mark 1:15)? Must we be baptized as well (Mark 16:16)? Do we have to be fruitful (Matt. 7:16)? Do we have to make Jesus our Lord? It’s either works or it’s not. Baptism is a work. Confession is a work. Belief is a response (see the last question), but everything else is effort. The point: how do you reconcile faith and works?
8.) Here on Earth, if someone can save a person from death, but they choose not to, they go to jail for negligent homicide. Why do we hold people to a higher standard than God?
Most of these are questions we asked as a child, but we repress them and lean instead on the traditional beliefs of our ancestors. It’s time to ask those questions again!
Verses
There are more verses than I could possibly list here, so I added most of them to the last section. Here are some great ones with which to challenge your audience. There are astounding implications to most of these, but I’ll trust in the intelligence of my reader and limit my exposition.
I Timothy 4:10 – “In fact, we labor and strive for this, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of everyone, especially of those who believe.”
Romans 11:32 – “For God has imprisoned all in disobedience, so that He may have mercy on all.”
I Corinthians 3:13-15 – “13 …each one’s work will become obvious, for the day will disclose it, because it will be revealed by fire; the fire will test the quality of each one’s work. 14 If anyone’s work that he has built survives, he will receive a reward. 15 If anyone’s work is burned up, it will be lost, but he will be saved; yet it will be like an escape through fire.”
Romans 17:17-20 – “17Since by the one man’s trespass, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive the overflow of grace and the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ. 18 So then, as through one trespass there is condemnation for everyone, so also through one righteous act there is life-giving justification for everyone. 19 For just as through one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, so also through the one man’s obedience the many will be made righteous. 20 The law came along to multiply the trespass. But where sin multiplied, grace multiplied even more.”
Romans 5:15 – “But the gift is not like the trespass. For if by the one man’s trespass the many died, how much more have the grace of God and the gift overflowed to the many by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ.” John 12:32 – “32 As for Me, if I am lifted up from the earth I will draw all people to Myself.” Pair this with John 6:44 – “No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him, and I will raise him up on the last day.” Colossians 1:20 – “…and through Him to reconcile everything to Himself by making peace through the blood of His cross—whether things on earth or things in heaven.”
In Luke 23:34, Jesus said of His murderers, “Father, forgive them, because they do not know what they are doing.” Did God answer His Son’s prayer? Hint: John 12:49 – “For I have not spoken on My own, but the Father Himself who sent Me has given Me a command as to what I should say and what I should speak.”
Romans 11:25-26, 30-32 – “25 So that you will not be conceited, brothers, I do not want you to be unaware of this mystery: A partial hardening has come to Israel until the full number of the Gentiles has come in. 26 And in this way all Israel will be saved…” “30 As you once disobeyed God, but now have received mercy through their disobedience, 31 so they too have now disobeyed, resulting in mercy to you, so that they also now may receive mercy. 32 For God has imprisoned all in disobedience, so that He may have mercy on all.”
SECTION 5: DEFEND YOURSELF!
This won’t be an exhaustive list of verses that people bring up, but I thought I’d give some common questions and answers I have come across. Again, I’ll start with the reason-based questions and go on to verses.
Common Responses
*1.) What about belief? *
A: Where in the Bible does it say that belief cannot happen after death? Show me that verse. You can’t because there is no such verse. Tradition says that this life is our only opportunity to believe; the Bible does not. (Philippians 2:8-11, Romans 14:11, Rev 5:13, Isa 45:23)
As a side note, I’m actually getting to the point where I’m seeing that belief is merely a response vs. a choice. I don’t believe it’s a prerequisite to salvation, but rather a result of it. That’s probably a bit too deep for the purposes of this line of reasoning, though.
2.) What about God’s justice?
A: I Corinthians 3:13-15 says that there will be great loss for many. There will be a great judgement and all of us will be tested and salted with fire (Mark 9:49). But read the verse in I Cor – none of this means loss of salvation! I would refer you to what judgment and fire mean virtually everywhere in the Bible. The theme of fire is an oft-used metaphor in the text and it is always with a view to purification and completion. We are judged with a view to purification.
Think about how Saul became Paul. He was the test case for what Christ will do for us! Paul was shown Christ and then he believed. If God gave the worst of the sinners (I Tim 1:15) this opportunity, don’t you think it’s unfair if even one person who ever lived didn’t have the same chance?
3.) If we preach this, then people will sin even more. What do they have to lose?
A: Paul ran into this exact issue with many of his churches (Romans 6:15). We need to remember that true Christianity is not about behavior modification; it’s about a relationship with God. What happens when someone shows you true love? Do you take advantage of it? Maybe… but that says more about you than that person. If you are truly loved and cared for by someone, then you want to be better for them. The closer we get to Christ, the more we emulate him. Otherwise, Christianity is just a fear-based system of beliefs. Our God has not given us a spirit of fear (2 Tim 1:7).
People who believe that you can’t lose your salvation have contended with this for centuries.
4.) What about hell?
A: refer to #2. Hell is never mentioned in the Old Testament (Hades refers to the unseen realm; see verse section below for Tartarus). In the New Testament, our translation of the word Hell is actually the word Gehenna (with a couple of exceptions). Gehenna was a trash heap/dump in Jerusalem and was used as a metaphor for the coming judgement in AD 70. It has nothing to do with eternal life.
Matt 23:36 - Truly I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation
Jesus goes as far as literally telling people that most of them will be alive when this stuff comes to past.
Read about AD 70 and read Josephus’ historical accounts of the events. You’ll be amazed at how many things were prophesied.
See below for a more in-depth explanation.
5.) Why does no one else believe in Universalism? A: In the words of u/CmndrCuddj,
“…people like Gregory of Nyssa, Clement of Alexandria, Origen Adamantius; All are within the first 300 years, all spoke native Greek(new testament was written in Greek) and all universalists. Then I turn to St. Augustine who spoke Latin, and confessed to not knowing Greek. Who’s word is more trustworthy?”
6.) God would not allow so many to believe the wrong thing A: On the contrary, God has given us great freedom to believe whatever we want. Look no further than Jesus’ contemporaries. They all believed that there would be a warrior-like savior. They thought the Messiah would come and defeat all of their enemies (e.g., Rome, etc.). They looked for a lion and instead they found the Lamb.
Specific Verses
This isn’t exhaustive, but here are the most common ones I hear. If you don’t want to read through these, you can skip to Section 6.
1.) Matthew 5:22 - …anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell.
This verse is used to demonstrate that Jesus mentions Hell in the first place and thereby showing that people are destined for it. The word for Hell here is Gahenna.
Gahenna is rooted in an Old Testament locale. It was a valley southwest of Jerusalem (you can see a picture of it right now on Google) and it belonged to a man named Hinnom; it has a very long history and all of it is bad. In 2 Chron. 28, King Ahaz burnt his children there (as did King Manasseh in 2 Chron. 33:6). In Jer. 7 and 19, Jeremiah prophesied of calamity and destruction coming upon the Jews there. From these verses, you will plainly see that Gahenna (a.k.a. the Valley of Hinnom, until God renamed it in Jer. 7:32) came to mean a place of burning, a valley of slaughter, and a place of fiery judgment. The Jews so hated this place that they cast all manner of refuse, deceased animals, and executed criminals into it after King Josiah came on the scene; it became a trash heap. That trash heap was always on fire, with worms, decomposition, the whole bit. A lot of Christians take this as symbolism for eternal punishment, but it’s symbolic of something else entirely: 70 A.D.
You can look at all of the uses of Gahenna in the Bible and see that none of these passages say that anyone of our day can go to ‘hell’. None of them associate hell with Satan. None of them say that Satan’s domain is hell. They speak of men being killed and destroyed in Gahenna, but none of them speak of them being tormented there. (You can see it for yourself. Here are all the mentions of Gahenna: Matt. 5:21-22, 29-30; 10:28; Luke 12:4-5; Matt. 18:9 and Mark 9:43-45; Matt. 23:15, 33; James 3:6).
So the use of Gahenna here is a fact. The history and understanding of what Gahenna was is a fact. The events of 70 A.D. are factual. But the interpretation of any verse (including Matt. 5:22) is up to the reader or teacher. Tradition dating back to the middle ages tells us that Gahenna is a metaphor for a place of eternal punishment, but I come down on the side of most of the early church fathers who interpreted this passage literally (the O.G.s like Irenaeus, Melito, Andreas, Tertullian, Athanasius, Chrysostom, etc.).
2.) Matthew 20:28 – “…just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.” Didn't Jesus pay a ransom to Satan for us?
The ransom was paid to Sin and Death itself. Let’s say that today you make chocolate chip cookies. What would happen if you accidentally dropped a cup of white vinegar into the batter while your mixer stirred it in immediately? The chemical nature of the dough would change. Where you once had something delicious, you would end up with something gross. The key to all of this is to understand what sin really is: Sin is not just a moral failing or an offense to the divine honor… sin is the introduction of corruption and demonic slavery into man’s entire being in the cosmos (Gen. 6:5, 12; II Peter 2:19; Psalm 14:1; Hosea 9:9; Eph. 4:22; Isa. 64:6; Romans 3:9-18… especially 3:10). And we know also that the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23). Death does not affect just man’s body, but his entire being. Apart from Christ, death is eternal and hopeless. Death is supreme separation from God (Isaiah 38:18).
The work of salvation is vastly more than the satisfaction of God’s offended honor. It addresses every aspect of man’s separation from God. From the first chapter of Genesis, God’s goal in our creation was the full and inexpressibly rich union of man with God. Adam and Eve were prototypes of that life (to a lesser extent than what we will have). They did not start as sinners, but as sharers in the Life of God. This reflects the goal of redemption, which is man’s participation in the divine nature... in other words, our participation in the Life of God. But alas, we were separated from God.
We are separated from God in three ways: through our nature (i.e., flesh), through sin, and through death (Rom. 6:21, 23; 8:2, 6, 38). This separation was overcome in three ways –
a. Through the Son’s Incarnation, whereby He opened a path for man’s return to union with God (Isaiah 7:14; 9:1-2,6-7;11:1-5); b. His sacrificial death on the Cross, by which He vanquished the reign of sin (Isaiah 50:4-9;52:13-15;53:1-12) – this was the ransom paid; c. And His Resurrection from the dead, by which He delivered us from that final enemy (Isaiah 56:6-8; 59:15-20; 60:1-22; 61:1-3; 62:1-5; 63:1-6).
Man’s repentance from sin is not sufficient to restore him to a relationship with God because sin is not merely a moral offense. Sin isn’t a spiritual state that can be altered by a spiritual adjustment and it’s not the sort of affront that’s remedied by an apology. According to the Bible, the state of sin is bondage to death and corruption. Death and corruption are not punishments imposed on sin -- they are a part of sin itself. They are the embodiment of sin (Romans 5:21). To deal with sin, it was necessary to deal with death (Luke 3:4-6, Heb. 2:14-16, I Cor. 15:42, 49).
Now back to the first question: from what did Christ save us? You might think He saved us from eternal torment and suffering in Hell, but I hope you can see that He did so much more than that. He restored (and then some) our “chemical structure” to become like Him and thereby able to share in His life, in His fellowship, in His righteousness, Peace, and Joy in the Holy Spirit! He saved us from eternal separation from Him by eternal death.
3.) Luke 16:19-31 – v.23 – In Hades, where he was in torment… v.24 I am in agony in this fire… v.26 – a great chasm has been set in place… v.28 warn them, so that they will not come to this place of torment
You can do a Google search to find that this parable was actually already a well-known Egyptian folk-tale about Si-Osiris when Jesus told it (Howard Marshall’s The Gospel of Luke, p. 634, Josephus’ A Discourse to Greeks Concerning Hades). In other words, the Pharisees knew this story, yet Jesus puts his own creative genius and spin behind a well-known fable to call out the Pharisees. Before we get to that, here are the biblical proofs of how we know for sure that it’s a parable:
a.) Jesus the Messiah never accuses the rich man of any sin. He is simply portrayed as a wealthy man who lived the good life. b.) Furthermore, Lazarus is never proclaimed to be a righteous man. He is just one who had the misfortune to be poor and unable to care for himself. c.) If this story is literal, then the logical implication is that all the rich are destined to burn in hell, while all the homeless and destitute will be saved. d.) Abraham’s bosom is not heaven (Heb. 11:8-10, 16… 16 being the key verse) e.) People in hell can’t talk to those in heaven (Isa. 65:17) f.) People are rewarded at Christ’s second coming, not at death (Revelation 22:12) g.) “The lost are punished in hell at the end of the world, not when they die (Matthew 13:40–42). Luke 16:31, the last verse of the story, contains a spiritual lesson, showing that the story is actually a parable. Parables cannot be taken literally. If we took parables literally, then we must believe that trees talk! (See this parable in Judges 9:8–15).”
(CREDIT: https://sites.google.com/site/theword4peace/home/lazarus-and-the-rich-man)
In Romans 11:1 Paul rhetorically asks if God has cast away His people, Israel. He answers his own question emphatically by saying "Certainly not!" He tells us that God has not cast away Israel. Paul writes that there is currently a remnant of Israel, analogous to the seven thousand reserved to God in Elijah's time (I Kings 19:18), that God has elected by grace. The rest God hardened, that the Gentiles might also be included in salvation through grace. He gives the resolution of the situation in verse 26.
Read Romans 11:25
The same God that blinded Israel unto disobedience will have mercy on all that have been rebellious due to that blindness. To quote Paul once again, "Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and unfathomable His ways!" Praised be the Eternal Creator of all things!
4.) Revelation 20:13-15 - 13 Then the sea gave up its dead, and Death and Hades gave up their dead; all were judged according to their works. 14 Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15 And anyone not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.
II Peter 2:17 – “These people are springs without water, mists driven by a whirlwind. The gloom of darkness has been reserved for them.”
Jude 1:13 – “wild waves of the sea, foaming up their shameful deeds; wandering stars for whom the blackness of darkness is reserved forever!”
Daniel 12:2 – “Many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake, some to eternal life, and some to shame and eternal contempt.”
This is the big one! There are many, many more verses like this and they all have one or both of the following in common:
a.) Fiery Imagery (i.e., Lake of Fire) or Darkness (i.e., the Second Death)
b.) Phrases like ‘Eternal Torment’ or ‘Eternal Contempt’ But there are a couple of common motifs that will unify these into one answer. But I want to start with a singular verse: Revelation 20:13-15. Let’s break it down verse by verse.
v.13 - Then the sea gave up its dead, and Death and Hades gave up their dead; all were judged according to their works. Death and Hades hand over the dead to the One on the great white throne (v. 11), Christ Himself. Christ has conquered Death and Hell and these last enemies have been placed under His feet (I Cor. 15:25).
v.14 - Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. What goes into the Lake of Fire? Death and Hades. Hell and Death, as we know it, are destroyed.
v.15a - And anyone not found written in the book of life… Let’s circle back to this after the second part of the verse.
v. 15b - …was thrown into the lake of fire. So wait a minute… Christ just claimed the dead back from the clutches of Death and Hell just to judge them and throw them into the Lake of Fire to be forever tormented? How does that reconcile with John 10:10 – “The thief cometh not, but that he may steal, and kill, and destroy: I came that they may have life, and may have [it] abundantly.” Jesus is a life-giver and redeemer, not a destroyer.
The ‘second death' and the ‘lake of fire ' is about finally putting to death of all creaturely identities in order to bring them into conformity with the identity of the Christ, the Lamb, Who is the Image of God (2 Cor. 4:4; Col. 1:15).
Now let’s circle back to the first part of this verse:
v.15a - And anyone not found written in the book of life… Let me set the stage here: recall Abram becoming Abraham for me; Jacob became Israel; Saul became Paul; Serai became Sarah; Simon became Peter… and the list goes on. Now read 2 Cor. 3:17 – “So then, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; what is old has passed away--look, what is new has come!”
Paul, Israel, and Abraham with their God-given names were all symbolic of that new creation being lived in time. In Romans 7:20 Paul says, “Now if I do what I do not want, I am no longer the one doing it, but it is the sin that lives in me.” So while some people theorize that Jesus’ name is the only name in the book of life and, by proxy, all of our names are in there…, others theorize that Death and Hades are the only things thrown in. While both may end up being true, that’s not the ultimate point I’m making here: throughout scripture, we are told that our old sin natures will “burn up” when thrown in so that sin might be done away with once and for all (I Cor. 15:57, Romans 6:6, Colossians 3:9, Romans 8:8, Ecclesiastes 7:20, 1 John 1:8). And guess what?! We will be given a new name:
Revelation 2:17 – “I will also give him a white stone, and on the stone a new name is inscribed that no one knows except the one who receives it.”
See also Isa. 56:5, Isa. 62:2, Isa. 65:15, and Rev 3:12. That’s what is in the Book of Life, meaning our old names (i.e., natures) are not. Believers in time have already been crucified with Christ, so they are safe from that judgement (Rev 2:11). So we know that every knee bows and every tongue confesses and with that belief, we’re given a new name – we are new creations (II Cor. 5:17). The "old man" will not enter through the ever-open gates of the New Jerusalem -- his "inheritance" is in the lake of fire. BUT THE PERSON OVER WHOM THE OLD MAN ONCE RULED, THE PERSON MADE IN THE IMAGE OF GOD, WILL BE SAVED (see Ephesians 4:22-24 and especially Colossians 3:9-10). And then God will be All in All (I Cor. 15:28).
Once they have been purified in the lake of fire, even the kings of the earth, those most vile of all men who had stood with the beast and the false prophet (Rev 19:19), will be free to enter the New Jerusalem through gates that never close and never shut anyone out (Rev. 21:24-26). It says it right there in Revelation.
So there is judgment. There are and people will experience unfathomable loss. There will be judgment for unbelievers (John 20:29 – “Blessed are those who believe without seeing Me.”). Where you see retributive judgement, however, I see restorative judgement. Remember, that a running theme in the Bible – especially the Old Testament – is fire as a means of purification. This is overwhelmingly the case as you can see in many, many verses (Zech. 13:9, I Peter 1:7, Isa. 48:10, Job 23:10, Prov. 17:3, Mal. 3:3, Heb. 12:29, etc.). How do we know that this is refiner’s fire and not tormenting fire? For one thing, I Corinthians confirms it for us:
1 Cor. 3:13-15 – “Each one’s work will be revealed. For the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each has done. If anyone’s work which he has built on the foundation endures, he will receive a reward. If anyone’s work is burned, he will suffer loss. But he himself will be saved, still going through the fire.”
Paul seems to be applying this universal truth to the particular group of men who are communicators of the Bible in (1 Corinthians 3:10-15). Blessed indeed are the victors who are not only not thrown into the lake of fire to experience loss but those who are not even hurt by the second death (Rev 2:11). Blessed are those who believe without seeing (John 20:29). The Lord himself is the fire of judgment that transforms us, conforming us to his glorified body (Rom 8:29; Phil. 3:21).
So now, let’s talk about the other verses here. The German theologian Wolfhart Pannenberg puts it best:
“The judgment that is put in Christ's hands is no longer destruction but a fire purging and cleansing. What it effects is the change to which Paul refers in 1 Cor. 15:50, the transforming of the mortal into immortality. Here is the solution to the apparent contradiction between the statements in 2 Cor. 5:10 and 1 Cor. 15:50: the transformation takes place by the fire of judgment. It involves the completing of penitence, but only as a moment in integration into the new life in fellowship with Jesus Christ. Thus the fire of judgment is purifying not destructive, fire.”
Daniel 12:2 - "Many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, but others to shame and everlasting contempt.”
In Jude 1:13, “forever” and “everlasting” is from the Greek word aiōna, which is the root word of – you guessed it – aionios. It means age-abiding, not forever and ever – it’s where we get the word ‘eon’. Again, do not take my word for it – it’s there for you to find in lexicons. Aionios only has implications of eternity when it describes something of God Himself. Aidios is the word used for 'absolute eternity' or for 'absolutely eternal', describing for instance "God's eternal (aidios) power and nature" in Romans 1:20 and in Jude 1:6 to describe the eternal power of God that keeps.
As for Daniel 12:2, there is plenty of evidence that this also points to 70 A.D. due to the language throughout chapter 11 and the parallels it has with several verses in Revelation. I’m pretty convinced of it myself and I could make that case here with another page of explanation, but let’s just say for the sake of argument that this verse is speaking eschatologically (P.S. - If you want to read about why it probably belongs in 70 A.D., I’ve got several books that go through all of Daniel + Revelation + Matthew 24, but Matthew 24 Fulfilled by John Bray is the best). Even if that is true, 12:2 uses the same word in the Septuagint translation (referred to as the LXX, it is the Greek translation of the Old Testament) and Jesus quotes it often, verbatim. Aionios is used here as well, but even the Hebrew word, owlam, often means the same thing (as in Jonah 2 when it’s used to refer to Jonah being in the belly of the whale for an age, or a set amount of time).
So what’s the conclusion? When every eye sees Him there will certainly be many who will be struck with grief at the sight of the Crucified Savior-especially those who pierced Him! But it will be God "striking in order to heal.” It will be a sorrow in the hands of God who is Love, producing repentance that does not coerce free will, leading to an irrevocable salvation, a salvation that no one will ever regret. The painful grief through an epistle of Paul led some people in Corinth to a repentance that led to salvation. This will happen on a larger scale when all flesh sees the salvation of the Lord (Isaiah 40:5; Luke 3:6; Isaiah 45:22), when every eye sees (Zechariah 12:10 Rev 1:7) the Son of Man who came with the clouds (Daniel 7:13-14, 27). Why, Saul of Tarsus on the Road to Damascus is a perfect example of what will happen to unbelievers on that day.
SECTION 6: SUPPORTING VERSES
This certainly isn’t all of the verses that supports our universalistic beliefs, but if you are still interested, here are several more (including some you’ve seen above) that further support the idea that Christ saved all.
Genesis 12:3 --- All peoples on earth will be blessed through Abraham.
Genesis 22:18 --- All nations on earth will be blessed through Abraham’s offspring.
Psalms 22:27 --- All the ends of the earth and all the families of the nations will acknowledge God.
Psalms 65:2 --- All men will come to God.
Psalms 86:9 --- All nations will worship and glorify God.
Psalms 103:8-9 --- God is compassionate, will not always accuse and will not be angry forever.
Psalms 145:9-10 --- The Lord has compassion on all His creation and all He has made will praise Him.
Psalms 145:13 --- The Lord loves all His creation.
Psalms 145:14 --- The Lord upholds all who fall.
Isaiah 25:6-8 --- God will prepare a feast for all people, He will destroy the shroud that enfolds all peoples, the sheet that covers up all nations. He will eliminate death, wipe away the tears from all faces and remove the disgrace of his people from all the earth.
Isaiah 45:22-23 --- God has sworn an oath that every knee will bow before Him and every tongue will swear by Him.
Isaiah 49:6 --- God’s salvation will be brought to the ends of the earth.
Isaiah 54:8 --- Although God will hide His face in a surge of anger, He will also have compassion with everlasting kindness.
Isaiah 57:16-18 --- God’s anger is not permanent. Although He punishes man, He will heal, guide and restore comfort to him.
Jeremiah 31:33-34 --- All men will know God, from the greatest to the least.
Lamentations 3:31-33 --- The Lord does not cast off forever. Although He brings grief, he will also be compassionate.
Ezekiah 18:21 --- God does not any pleasure in the death of the wicked. Rather, He is pleased when they repent.
Micah 7:18 --- God does not stay angry forever.
Matthew 18:13 --- Like the man who owes a hundred sheep and is not willing to lose even one, God is not willing that any one be lost.
Luke 2:10 --- The birth of Jesus is good news for all the people.
Luke 3: 5, 6 --- John the Baptist quotes Isaiah’s words that all mankind will see God’s salvation.
John 1:29 --- Jesus is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world.
John 3:35 --- God sent Jesus to save the world.
John 4:42 --- God has committed all things to Christ.
John 5:25 --- Even the dead will hear the sound of Christ and all who hear will live.
John 6:37 --- Everything that God has given to Christ will come to him.
John 12:32 --- When Jesus is lifted up from the earth, he will draw all men to himself.
John 12:47 --- Jesus came to save the world.
John 17:2 --- God granted Christ authority over all people so that Christ may give eternal life to all that God has given him.
Acts 3:20-21 --- Jesus must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything.
Romans 3:3-4 --- The unbelief of some will not nullify God’s faithfulness.
Romans 5:18 --- The act of obedience of one man (Jesus) will bring life for all men.
Romans 8:19-21 --- Creation itself will be liberated and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God.
Romans 8:38-39 --- Nothing can separate us from the love of God that is in Christ.
Romans 11:32 --- God made all people imprisoned by disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.
1 Corinthians 15:22-28 --- All will be made alive in Christ, but each in his own turn and ultimately Christ will subdue all his enemies, eliminate death and God will be all in all.
2 Corinthians 5:15 --- Christ died for all.
2 Corinthians 5:19 --- Through Christ, God was reconciling the world to Himself.
Ephesians 1:11 --- God will bring all things under heaven and on earth under Christ.
Ephesians 4:10 --- Christ ascended higher then all the heavens to fill the whole universe.
Philippians. 2:9-11 --- Every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord (In 1 Corinthians 12:3, Paul writes that no one can say “Jesus is Lord” except by the Holy Spirit)
Colossians 1: 19-20 --- God was pleased to reconcile to Himself, all things on earth and in heaven through the blood of Christ.
1 Timothy 2:4-6 --- God wants all men to be saved and to know the truth. Can God’s desire be thwarted?
1 Timothy 4:10 --- God is the Saviour of all men, especially (not exclusively) those who believe.
Titus 2:11-12 --- God’s grace, which brings salvation has appeared to all men.
Hebrews 2:9 --- Jesus tasted death for everyone.
1 John 2:2 --- Christ is the atoning sacrifice of the sins of the whole world.
1 John 3:8 --- Christ appeared to destroy the devil’s works. The doctrine of eternal damnation denies the victory of Christ!
1 John 4:14 --- Christ is the Saviour of the world.
Revelations 5:13 --- Every creature in heaven, on earth, under the earth, and on the sea will sing praises to him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb (Christ).
Revelations 21:4-5 --- God will dwell with men and he will wipe every tear from their eyes, death, mourning, crying, pain and the old order of things will pass and everything will be made new.
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2020.09.21 17:43 icecoolsushobhan [r/IndiaSpeaks - Biweekly Geopolitics Thread] Abraham Accords signed, TikTok escapes US ban, and the CIA's Tibet Program

Welcome to this week's edition of the Biweekly Geopolitics Thread, where we discuss all the news from around the world. Discussion does not have to be related to India, and users are encouraged to share and discuss stories in the comments. Here are a few stories to get the discussion rolling:

Top 5 stories

  1. COVID-19 cases surge in Europe
European countries, once presented as benchmarks for effective use of lockdowns to tackle the coronavirus pandemic, are experiencing a resurgence, fueled by movement of people across countries. On Sunday, France reported over 10,000 new cases while the UK reported 4,000. The WHO warned that a very serious situation was emerging in Europe, which is compounded by the fact that the previous lockdown had such a massive economic impact that doing it again could be difficult politically, with protests already erupting in Madrid. Nonetheless, new restrictions on travel and daily life are expected.
  1. PLA Air Force simulates attack on US base
The Communist Party of China's armed air wing - the PLA Air Force - released a video of simulated war games in which nuclear-capable fighter jets were shown to be attacking a model of the U.S.'s Andersen Air Force Base in Guam. At the same time, the PLAAF sent fighter jets close to Taiwan, beyond the half-way point in the Taiwan Straits, causing Taiwan to deploy an air defense missile system and scramble its own jets. This points to increased tension in the East China Sea, where the US has been conducting naval operations with two of its aircraft carriers.
  1. Abraham Accords signed between Israel and UAE, Bahrain
In a glitzy ceremony at the White House, Israeli PM Benjamin Netanyahu (who is also the country's foreign minister) joined the foreign ministers of UAE and Bahrain to sign the historic peace deal - called the Abraham Accords - that would establish diplomatic ties between the countries for the first time, doubling the number of Arab countries with official ties to Israel. Marking that historic move, Saudi Arabia allowed an Israeli El Al flight to use its air space en route to Abu Dhabi. Previously, only Air India was allowed to fly over Saudi Arabia in flights to and from Israel. The presence of Bahrain - largely seen as a satellite state of Saudi Arabia - strongly implies that the latter is on board with the deal as well. Speculation is rife that Morocco and Sudan are also looking to recognize Israel.
  1. TikTok and WeChat survive US ban, for now
On Sunday, the US was all set to ban new downloads of popular Chinese apps TikTok and WeChat, over concerns that the apps were used for surveillance by the Chinese Communist Party. However, both survived the ban. TikTok's US operations will be owned partly by Walmart and Oracle in a deal that has the blessings of the White House, while a federal judge stayed a ban on WeChat. Oracle will host all of TikTok's US data locally. The WeChat issue is more complicated, as it is the only means of communication between American citizens of Chinese origin and their families back home in China, where virtually every other app is banned.
  1. Rare sarcophagi found in Egypt
In a happy moment for human history, archaeologists in Egypt announced the discovery of a tomb with 27 sarcophagi dating back to about 2,500 years. Experts at the site, who had to climb down an 11 m deep well in difficult conditions (no heavy equipment is allowed at the site to avoid damaging it), say that the tomb seems to have been unopened since the sarcophagi were first buried. The tomb was uncovered in the town of Saqqara, south of the capital Cairo, which was an active burial ground in one of the ancient world's great civilizations.

Geopolitical History: The CIA in Tibet

With tensions between India and China at the border reaching historic levels, there has been renewed discussion about Tibet. For over a thousand years, the plateau, often called the "roof of the world" for its height, was a Buddhist theocracy led by a religious figure, the Dalai Lama. The kingdom, like Korea, Japan, and Vietnam, was a vassal state of the Chinese emperor, paying an annual tribute but not being directly administered by China. All that changed in 1950, when the PLA invaded and annexed Tibet, forcing the Dalai Lama to flee to India and bringing China's border right to the Indian subcontinent.
For two decades, the US through the CIA, the State Department, and the Department of Defense, ran operations in Tibet to prevent expansion of communism in the "autonomous region" and keep up hopes for an independent Tibet. In declassified documents, it has been shown that senior US administration members saw Tibet through two lenses: first, China's view that control of Tibet would give it a buffer zone in case western powers chose to invade China via India; and second, the American view that China and the Soviet Union would use Tibet as a staging ground to invade South and West Asia if necessary. In either case, an independent Tibet was considered the best means of maintaining status quo.
The CIA program in Tibet involved training armed Tibetan resistance fighters as well as spreading anti-Communist propaganda, and began when Gyalo Thondup, the Dalai Lama's exiled brother, made contact with CIA operatives in India. At the height of the program, the CIA was spending almost $2 million a year. Fighters were trained both in the US as well as in a secret camp in the Nepal-Tibet border, and it is believed that it was these fighters that enabled the Dalai Lama to safely escape to India before he could be arrested by the PLA in 1959. Fighters also intercepted Chinese documents, proving to be a valuable source of intelligence into the world's most populous Communist-controlled country.
The Tibetan resistance was successful in holding back PLA forces in Tibet, who by 1960 numbered into tens of thousands and were facing huge costs and logistical challenges, but it led to the local civilian population facing harsh reprisals, including mass arrests and bombing of Tibetan Buddhist monasteries. Declassified documents also showed that Indian Prime Minister Nehru opposed any anti-Communist activities in India, only willing to support the Dalai Lama's right to practice his religion but not Tibetan independence. The CIA program in Tibet came to an abrupt halt in 1972, after the historic visit of US President Richard Nixon to China and normalization of ties between the two countries. Fighters were allegedly given INR 10,000 to buy land or start a business in India, and all support to Tibet was halted by order of the White House.
In his 1991 autobiography, the Dalai Lama criticized the CIA for supporting Tibet not because they cared about Tibet, but merely as a pawn in the Cold War.

What stories from around the world caught your attention?
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2020.09.19 16:10 s810 Old Austin Tales: North Austin Meetups of Prehistoric Eras - (4000BC - 1690AD)

The folks down at the Austin History Center are slowly scanning archival photos and adding to UNT's Portal to Texas History even in these pandemic times. Among others, there are quite a few new photos of land parade floats from the early Austin Aqua Festivals in 1962 and 63. It's disappointing to see photos like this 1963 Austin Aqua Festival parade float ignorantly depicting Native Americans in a less than flattering light.
But a few of those kids dressed as stereotypical and generic 1960s natives probably had elderly relatives who remembered the time before all the tribes were ejected from this area and probably would have still thought of them as little more than savages. The photo gives context to the times in which it was taken. The Austinites of that era seem to have had less respect for those people who lived here hundreds or thousands of years before the Spanish and French started roaming around here.
As a modern Austinite I don't see why this attitude should be held up. Those were humans who lived here, if even sporadically, and loved the land and the creeks and trees as much or more than you or I. They just called the landmarks different names back then. It is known that some of the tribes who used to live around here were warlike and confrontational with other tribes. My own grandmother was born in Austin in the 1930s and often told me a tall tale about a fictional battle between the Comanche and 1000 Apache warriors in the hills near Lake Travis. (sometimes the battle took place in the area around where we were sitting in traffic depending on grandma's mood) It was a Thermopylae/Alamo-like tale of outnumbered Comanche braves winning the day by running to the hill now known as Commanche Peak and waiting in ambush. But grandma often told some whoppers and that was surely one of them. I've never read about even the scantest evidence that something like that took place here, if even only in oral histories of the tribes involved. But who knows. My point is we really don't know a whole lot about what the people who lived here before everything, and what they did while they were here.
Today I wanted to share some small bit of the real story of these people who lived here when real estate was free if you could keep it from the wild beasts or competing tribes. Because the real story, from what little we know of it, is really just as captivating as Grandma's tall tales were.
On a related note I recently discovered the AustinFound podcast from Michael Barnes and a few other folks at The Statesman. They've been writing the good historyposts on The Statesman's Austin360.com for a while now under the same name and I've referenced them a lot here before. Michael Barnes knows his stuff. He has written a multi-volume book set called Indelible Austin and was one of the people who went on the expedition to look for traces of the 1730 Spanish mission set up somewhere in this area. In episodes 1, 6, and 27 of the podcast he talks about the three main native tribes in this area: The Apache, who considered this area the northeastern border of their roaming grounds and had mostly vacated by the 1800s, the Comanche, who were descended from the Apache (edit: fixed) Wyoming Shoshone tribe long ago in modern Utah and Wyoming and considered this area the southeastern border of their expanding roaming grounds, and the Tonkawa tribe, who were also war like but had a different culture and their own ways. They especially were early victims of the diseases brought by european contact.
One thing I agree with Michael Barnes about is how The Tonkawa, despite having more of a territorial claim to the area Austin is in now than the other two tribes, are under-represented in the old chronicles written down by early white settlers. The Comanche are namedropped in the written accounts of the 1800s quite a bit for their 'depredations' on early settlers. It was the Comanche were the only tribe in this region who, for a time, rebuffed all attempts to subjugate them from Spain, Mexico, and Anglos. But the Tonkawa, on the other hand, being so few in number had to ally themselves with whites against the other two tribes. Because of this they were westernized quickly and assumed a sort of sub-caste in frontier society. Early accounts refer to them as 'Tonks' and talk in exaggerated ways about their cannibalism and wolf-worship. From what I understand the people eating only took place after winning a great battle. The tribe has a website nowadays where you can learn about their culture, their colorful traditional clothing and how it was made, and the Trail of Tears out of Central Texas.
It's not often talked about what tribes were here before the Tonkawa and the Comanche and Apache. It's a topic I'm always looking to learn more about. If you've lived here a while you might have heard of the Leanderthal Lady. Her remains are estimated to be between 10000 and 13000 years old and according to this article was found with buried with a shark tooth. I've also talked about the digs at the Westcave Preserve near Hamilton Pool, and the Levi and Smith Rock Shelters, where evidence of human habitation dates back 10000 years at least. But that brings up the question: Who lived in the area in between then and the time of the Tonkawa? I know there are stories from early settlers about an 'Indian Village' of an unnamed tribe very near the old Santa Monica Springs on the Colorado River but that's about it. Well thanks to some archeological digs over the years when new stuff had been built we know about a few frequent party spots some of the people alive back then liked to congregate in. I've found archeological reports from three separate digs in spots around North Austin, which is fine because the good rock shelters appear to have been in what is now South Austin anyway...
Let's start in the order the reports were made. The first concerns a site where people camped repeatedly over the course of the last 4000 years that today lies in a neighborhood near the intersection of North Lamar and Braker Lane. Back in the neighborhood is a street called Jetta Court. This neighborhood dates back to the mid to late 1960s and when built the area was already known for arrowhead deposits. In the 1980s further digs established the whole area around where Walnut Creek Park is today was once a major habitation area. But back in '68 the home builder company was partially done with the neighborhood and paid for a salvage dig after reports of trespassers "pothunting".
The report from the salvage dig was published in the Bulletin of the Texas Archeological Society, Volume 47, 1976 and is available in the UNT archive. You can read the whole thing if you feel like getting into the weeds. Quoting the abstract and introduction:
During the course of several weekends in 1968 and 1969, students from The University of Texas at Austin carried out test excavations at the Jetta Court site in Travis County, central Texas. These investigations constituted a salvage effort designed to obtain information on this site before it was destroyed by construction activities in a housing development. The terrace deposits at Jetta Court yielded a long Archaic sequence, including a deeply buried occupation which occurred stratigraphically below Early Archaic materials. The results of the excavations are described, and detailed analyses of the lithic debris and faunal re mains are presented.
The Jetta Court site (41 TV 151) is located within the city limits of Austin, Texas, buried in terrace deposits on the west side of Walnut Creek (Figs. 1-3). The site was brought to the attention of the Texas Archeological Research Laboratory (TARL) of The University of Texas at Austin in the fall of 1968 by reports of pothunting in an area slated for a housing subdivision. Inspection of the site by TARL personnel indicated that it should be tested before the planned construction activities were begun.
Excavations, directed by graduate students in anthropology at The University of Texas at Austin, were carried out with volunteer help. Work was done on weekends during a period from December, 1968, to February, 1969. Since the site was unprotected during the week, numerous instances of vandalism occurred. One unit of excavation was eventually ruined, but the others were not seriously damaged. This combination of weekend excavation and weekday vandalism limited effective investigation to stratigraphic testing and backhoe trenching. Exposures of horizontal tracts were not done partly be- cause of fear that it would lead to more extensive depredations on the part of the pothunters, and partly because the site was considerably deeper than was anticipated.
The writers would like to acknowledge the assistance and under- standing of Mr. Cecil Lamour, representing Conann Construction, Inc., in permitting the excavations. His patience with our backhoe operations, in particular, was most helpful.
How dramatic. Apparently someone thought there was buried treasure nearby. I wonder what could have given them that idea.. Here's a photo of the site at the time and Here's a map of the dig site with the holes marked. All of this area is built over today.
The dig was done hastily and the vandalism limited the findings. The report goes on describe two burned rock midden sites located within the boundaries of the dig. These were like old campfires that had been repeatedly built over for a number of years during two different eras.
Some further highlights from the report:
Here's a photo of the one of the holes.
There are a couple of photos of some of the lithic projectile points found in the upper, newer rock midden. Here's one. Here's another. And a couple from the lower, older midden. Here's one from the lower and here's another. There are many more photos and charts showing the finds, their classifications, and their locations in relation to one another in the layered deposits. This is how most of the rest of the report goes.
There were many animal bones and shells found in some areas indicating people ate there, or used the site for industry. Here a list of animal species found in the bones they can identify. On the menu: snails, turtles, opossum, coyote, deer, bison, cow, a couple of kinds of rabbits and mice, and strangely gophers. Apparently there used to be gophers around here when the climate favored grasslands over forests.
The distribution of animal bones is nicely charted here in size and age, Category A being the largest animals like bison and Category C being the smallest, such as rats and snails. The report notes that remains of small animals would degrade faster so that might skew the results.
To sum it all up because it's way too long to copypaste, the two burned rock middens at Jetta Court don't contribute a whole lot of new information to the story besides offering evidence that the spot was a place for habitation. I think if I understand it correctly (correct me if I'm wrong) the lower midden dates back over 3000 years while the upper midden dates back about 2000 years. The report talks about not knowing how to classify the artifacts within the archaic period. It recommends further digs in the area but acknowledges that's probably not possible with the neighborhood going up. What the writers didn't know is that just a few years later digs would begin at many different sites in what is now Walnut Creek Park that further expanded the knowledge of that area and its earliest inhabitants.
Moving on to the next site, which lies a little bit east of there at what became the Jourdan-Bachman Pioneer Farm, once an actual farm near Sprinkle now turned into a live action museum exhibit by the city which is beloved by schoolkids on field trips. It turns out that when the farm was built in the 1850s, part of the property contained a much older camp site that was favored by natives a thousand years ago. A report was written in 1994 about a dig in 1983. (PDF warning). The site of the native cultural deposits was at the southern end of the farm. Here is a map of the site in relation to the farm.
The PDF isn't as copypaste friendly as the other UNT article but it's short and I can summarize the findings. It's really more of just an abstract compared to the other long report. It's worth taking the time to read if you can handle PDFs and you're interested in the history of the area at all. In the introduction they describe how the farm was bought by the Heritage Society of Austin in the 1950s and belonged to the City of Austin by 1980 as part of the same deal that established Walnut Creek Park. More than a few digs had been done in the area around there in the early 1980s. It describes 22 different ancient burials found at one nearby site. At the farm site itself there was a deposit of projectile points over a meter thick of most types found in the area during the archaic era.
That brings us to the third site. called Millican Bench. Never heard of it? Me neither. It's a tiny spot just south of The Arboretum today that was obliterated by the construction of Loop 360 in the 1970s. Before the highway cut through the site, TxDot conducted a dig in 1970 and 71 on a small limestone plateau (thus the bench) where artifacts had been reported by the previous landowner. The report on the site dig is another PDF, but it was written in 2003, is very detailed, and will let me copypaste from it. Here's a map of the site showing where it was in the roadbed of modern Loop 360.
Quoting from the introduction:
Located in Travis County, the Millican Bench site(41TV163) was the first archeological site excavated by the Texas Department of Transportation (TxDOT; then Texas Highway Department) as a mitigation effort for highway construction under the requirements of the National Environmental Protection Act of 1966. The excavation was conducted between September of 1970 and February of 1971under the direction of Frank Weir, then of the Texas Highway Department. In August of 2002, TxDOT contracted with the Center for Archaeological Research (CAR) at The University of Texas at San Antonio (Work Authorization#57014PD004) to conduct an inventory and assessment of the archeological collections and documentation associated with site 41TV163, develop possible research questions that could be pursued with the site data, and to prepare the project material for permanent curation. Based on that assessment(Mahoney et al. 2003a), and following consultation with TxDOT, CAR further was directed to produce a final report.This document constitutes the final report on the TxDOT work at 41TV163. Included in this report are a description of the site, excavation procedures, and an analysis of selected components of the data collected over three decades ago.
To report on excavations and analyze data collected over30 years ago presents several challenges. Foremost among these is that if one wishes to avoid a primarily historical perspective, data collected using earlier field methods to investigate earlier theoretical concerns must be molded to address current questions. In this case, the disconnect between the theoretical and methodological considerations that guided the excavation of 41TV163, which appear to have been focused on chronology and cultural history,and current research interests in Texas archeology is exacerbated by the loss of a large portion of the field notes,some photo logs, and some of the artifacts and samples during the intervening years. Nevertheless, in the assessment document (Mahoney et al. 2003a), we identified a series of current research issues that could be addressed using data generated by the work at 41TV163. These include investigating temporal changes in subsistence patterns and changes in lithic technology. In addition, we investigate several aspects of site use during the Late Prehistoric occupation of 41TV163.
So what this is saying is that basically the original field work and notes were lost and they had to reconstruct everything. I guess they thought it was worth it in scientific value to reconstruct or else maybe because it was the forerunner to TxDot's first dig. In any case the findings showed evidence of habitation a bit later than the other sites to the east. The intro continues:
Initially, seven discrete areas, designated A through G, were identified at Millican Bench. Figure 1-2 (the map linked earlier) presents a section of an aerial photo with the sketched locations of these seven areas, along with the Loop 360 center line. The photo appears to have been created at the time of the fieldwork. Area A consisted of a burned rock midden located on a topographic bench. Another probable burned rock midden, Area B, was situated on the slope and creek terrace below the bench.Located just to the west of Area B were two other areas,designated C and D. These appeared to be occupation areas with burned rock and other debris present. Three additional areas, designated E, F, and G, were located across the creek east of Areas A–D. Area E was a burned rock midden that measured approximately four meters in diameter. Area F contained a concentration of occupation refuse with burned rock and chipped stone, while Area G was a broad bedrock exposure containing scattered chipped stone debris.With the exception of Area G, where only surface collection was conducted, all areas (A through F) had some level of excavation. At 41TV163, TxDOT personnel recorded 11features, including a human burial (Feature 10) and a possible structure (Feature 3). In addition, more than 200cores, 1,400 tools, 400 projectile points, and 42,500 pieces of debitage were collected. With the exception of any evidence for Paleo-indian occupation, the 41TV163 materials seem to reflect most prehistoric periods. Collected projectile point types thought to be diagnostic include Wells, Early Split Stem, Early Triangular, Martindale, and Uvalde forms dating to much of the Early Archaic (8000–6000 BP); Nolan,Travis, and a single Andice point, all dating to the Middle Archaic (6000–4000 BP); Bulverde, Pedernales, Williams,Lange, Marshall, Montell, Castroville, Ensor, Frio, Fairland,and Darl forms dating throughout the Late Archaic (4000–1250 BP); and Scallorn points, dating to the early portion of the Late Prehistoric (1250–700 BP). A small amount of historic and/or modern material was also collected, though it is not considered in any detail in this report.
Long story short, this area was frequently visited from about 4000BC-1300AD, mostly toward the latter date, and shows different patterns in habitation indicating the different tribal customs in use at that point. In addition to rock middens and lots of projectile points and rock flakes, an ancient human burial was found. Also many animal bones like the other sites indicating different eating areas.
Well there you have a few stories of the people who lived here before recorded history. I hope one day more local history writers and bloggers can address this topic in more depth than I have time for here today. I know there are a lot of people out there like me who would love to know more. Time is way short so I've got to wrap this up quick. I obviously don't have any related photos from prehistory but have some newly added old Aqua Fest photos from the UNT archive for Bonus Pics today.
Bonus Pic #1 - "Photograph of two people on a mini pool at the Aqua Festival Land Parade event" - August 3, 1962
Bonus Pic #2 - "Photograph of group of people at Aqua Fest event" - 1963
Bonus Pic #3 - "Photograph of the scenery at Aqua Fest event. A child is seen seated wearing a cape and crown. " - 1963
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2020.09.17 20:07 Rumored17 Refutations for Every Main Pro-Pit Argument

1."It's all how you raise them."

And more:
• ⁠Lockwood, R. A. N. D. A. L. L. (2016). Ethology, ecology and epidemiology of canine aggression. The Domestic Dog: Its Evolution, Behaviour & Interactions with People,, 160-181.
• ⁠Abrantes, R., Site, A., Camp, S., Diving, F. A. Q., Camp, G. P., Pages, M., ... & User, C. C. (2016). Aggressive Behavior—Inheritance and Environment.
• ⁠van den Berg, L. I. N. D. A. (2016). Genetics of dog behavior. The Domestic Dog: Its Evolution, Behavior and Interactions with People, 5, 69.
• ⁠O'Neill, D. G., & Packer, R. M. (2016). The First Canine Behavior and Genetics Conference: Summary and recommendations for future directions in canine behavioral science. Journal of Veterinary Behavior, 16, 6-12.
• ⁠Sørensen, M. (2016). Breeding aggression: Review of recent literature concerning the influence of genes on aggressive behaviour (Doctoral dissertation).
• ⁠Schilder, M. B., van der Borg, J. A., & Vinke, C. M. (2019). Intraspecific killing in dogs: predation behavior or aggression? A study of aggressors, victims, possible causes and motivations. Journal of Veterinary Behavior.
These studies all show that genetics play a large role in dog behavior. Most are related to Pit Bulls or aggression, but some just show that there are noticeable differences between dog breeds based on their breed. Here are some anecdotal sources to support the claims that Pit Bulls are born with a tendency to be aggressive:
In addition, "it's all how you raise them" goes against the very existence of dog breeds. If someone is arguing this, they are saying a Labrador Retriever will have the same instincts as a Border Collie, which will have the same instincts as a Doberman, which will have the same instincts as a Great Pyrenees, which will have the same instincts as a Dachshund, etc. This is observably and demonstrably false. Humans created different dog breeds with different temperaments and physical and behavioral traits through selective breeding. This is why dog breeds exist, this is why breed standards exist, this is why people can reasonably and accurately predict how a dog will act based on breed. Are there exceptions? Of course. However, that is just what they are- exceptions. Different dog breeds have different traits and tendencies dependent on what they were selectively bred for.

2. "Chihuahuas are more aggressive."

This is just a disingenuous attempt to derail the conversation. Even if Chihuahuas are more aggressive, they don't/can't kill people. If Chihuahuas were as large as Pit Bulls, perhaps this would be a conversation worth having- seeing as this is not the case, there is no argument to be had here.
I try to emphasize that the issue with Pits is how many people and pets they kill. Pit Bulls are not just biting people- they are killing, severely maiming, and mauling people. There is a huge difference, and it is important to recognize many Pit fanatics will try to lump in all dog bites with the maulings Pit Bulls are responsible for. They are not the same. This is similar to the "Labs bite more" argument- again, we are not just talking about bites. Keep the discussion focused on severe maulings, maimings, and deaths, because that is what BSL targets.
From 1982-2020 no Chihuahua has ever killed anyone. This source breaks down attacks by breed, child or adult victim, and death or maiming.

3. "There's no such thing as a Pit Bull." and "Pit Bulls can't be identified."

A good way to avoid even getting to this apologist bingo point is by using the phrasing "Pit Bull type dogs" as opposed to Pit Bulls. However, you can also just explain that "Pit Bull" is an umbrella term for four closely related dog breeds- the American Pit Bull Terrier, the American Staffordshire Terrier, the Staffordshire Bull Terrier, and the American Bully. The American Pit Bull Terrier and the American Staffordshire Terrier are actually so similar they can be dual registered as an AmStaff with the AKC and a APBT with the UKC. Until recently, most dog DNA tests would not even separate AmStaff from APBT due to the extreme similarities. This is also just another deflection technique- everyone knows what someone means by "Pit Bull" just as everyone knows what someone means by "Golden Retriever." This is what "pit bull" means legally.
Now, because "Pit Bull" does refer to 4 dog breeds rather than one, Pit apologists will often cry "well of course 4 dog breeds will kill more people!" but keep in mind that these 4 dog breeds have killed more people than 300+ other dog breeds combined. The Pit Bull umbrella kills more people than every other group or type of dogs and more than every other dog breed combined.
Regarding Pit Bulls being unidentifiable:
Pit Bulls have just as many obvious identifying characteristics as other dog breeds. There is no reason to believe Pit Bulls suffer from misidentification more than other dog breeds. There is reason to believe Pit Bulls are intentionally mislabeled as other breeds when in shelters, however. In addition, when discussing fatal Pit Bull attacks specifically, more often than not there are photos of the Pit Bulls involved so anyone can verify for themselves if they were Pit Bull type dogs. Genetic testing is not required for breed identification- anyone who argues this is being disingenuous. Another point is that we are constantly inundated with Pro-Pit propaganda; there is simply no way we can have Pixar shorts such as Kitbull and a new Dodo video every week about Pit Bulls and still be expected to believe the average person cannot visually identify a Pit Bull.

4. "Pits are no more dangerous than other dogs."

The statistics also support our side here- Pit Bulls have killed more people than all other dog breeds combined. Pit Bulls are not the largest, nor the strongest dogs out there. They do not have the strongest bite force. They are more deadly than other dog breeds because humans selectively bred them to be as deadly as possible. They are deadly due to the nature of their attacks and the behavioral traits they display when attacking such as gameness and a bite style mentioned in some of these studies, along with their physical traits.

5. "It used to be Dobermans, Rottweilers, and German Shepherds that people wanted to ban!"

Pit Bulls have killed more people than those three breeds ever did, even at the height of their popularity, even combined. There is also no evidence supporting this claim, and in fact, quite a lot of evidence showing it's completely false.
It is important to note as well that none of these breeds have an entire lobby supporting them. They do not have communities dedicated to attack victim harassment, misinformation, and lies, unlike the Pit Bull has. Something interesting to consider is the bias online when looking at these breeds and other restricted breeds vs pages about Pit Bulls. Wikipedia in particular is very obviously being manipulated by Pit Bull fanatics.
None of this manipulation is occurring on the pages for Dobermans, Rottweilers, or German Shepherds. These three breeds never reached anywhere close to the level of suffering and carnage Pit Bulls are responsible for. There has never been a concerted effort to ban these breeds, although some are targeted by apartment restrictions due to insurance issues. There is also no lobby supporting the misinformation and misrepresentation of these breeds.

6. "Dogsbite.org is biased and unreliable."

Dogsbite is completely open and transparent about their data collection strategies. They provide identification photographs and have all of their citations publicly listed. Citations and Photographs
Here is a challenge I like to give to people who claim Dogsbite is unreliable, although I have yet to receive a legitimate response:
Have you actually looked into dogsbite.org yourself? You do know that dogsbite tracks every fatal dog attack, regardless if it's a Pit or not? It appears anti-Pit because most fatal dog attacks are done by Pits. They're not only posting Pit attacks- there are just so many more fatal Pit attacks than other breeds it appears they are. Here's a proposal for you: Go to 2020 and late 2019, a time frame for which news reports are still abundantly available all over the internet, and fact-check ANY FOUR DOG-BITE FATALITIES OF YOUR CHOOSING, two where the killer dogs are said to be pit/mixes, and two cases where the killer dogs are not said to be pit/mixes:
  1. Did DogsBite accurately name the person killed?
  2. Did DogsBite accurately summarize the circumstances in which the person was killed?
  3. Did DogsBite accurately identify the breed(s) of the killer dog(s)?
  4. Did DogsBite provide a photo or photos of the killer dog(s) so you can judge for yourself what type of dog(s) you think did the killing?
DogsBite and Wikipedia both provide links to news stories about these fatal attacks. If you don't want to use the news links provided by DogsBite, then use the ones on Wikipedia that cover the same stories. DogsBite also provides links to autopsy reports, police reports and 911 calls, so you can compare these primary sources with the summaries on the DogsBite page and assess whether those summaries are accurate.

7. "Human aggressive Pit Bulls were culled!"

This is a myth. While human aggression was not something that was typically selectively bred for it is a myth that most human aggressive Pits were culled. That was not the case, and it still is not the case today. One look at shelter descriptions of Pits with bite histories and severe aggression issues shows these dogs are not being euthanized, and there are several instances of Pit Bulls who have killed people being bred.
There's no evidence whatsoever that dog fighters routinely destroyed human-aggressive dogs and refused to breed them. u/NorthTwoZero wrote at length about why it's a myth here, and this blogger put together a documented list of famously human-aggressive fighting dogs who not only weren't "culled" but were bred so often that they produced over 1,200 known, registered offspring:
"The man-biters were culled and the pit bulls were not bred for human aggression myths were created from thin air, complete fabrications. There is not a sliver of truth in the myth that dogmen culled man-biters. Not only weren't human aggressive pit fighters NOT culled, but a talented man-biter was heavily bred, his stud services were in high demand and the stud fees commanded a premium. The progeny of man-biters are still sought out long after he or she has passed away. This Italian game-dog website lists their choice for the Best Ever fighting dogs, three of the five are known man-biters and the other two trace their origins to the others on their "Best" list. Some famous man-biters have their own facebook fan pages. If you happen to be a 10x winner with 3 kills and scratching on the carcass, people tend to overlook a little thing like the danger she poses to people and she is also likely to be nominated for the cover of this month's International Sporting Dog Journal. Some famous man-biters not only have a facebook fan page, they have their own promotional merchandise too."

8. "Pit Bulls were nanny dogs!" or "Pit Bulls were America's dog!"

First, I usually ask questions that demonstrate out how absurd that claim is. What is a nanny dog? What duties does a nanny dog perform? Why would a dog type be called a "Pit Bull" if it nannied? Where does the name "Pit Bull" come from? Why is it necessary for Pits to have such large, gaping mouths and extremely muscular bodies if they were nannies? Then here is some actual info:
The first appearance of the term "Nanny Dog" dates from a 1971 NYT interview with the then president of the Staffordshire Bull Terrier Club of America, Lillian Rant, who called Staffordshire Bull Terriers "nursemaid dogs" for no apparent reason (other than to attempt to re-brand fighting dogs as family pets).
BAD RAP shared a link. It's Dog Bite Prevention Week. Did you know that there was never such thing as a 'Nanny's Dog'? This term was a recent invention created to describe the myriad of vintage photos of children enjoying their family pit bulls (see link for details about vintage photos). While the intention behind the term was innocent, using it may mislead parents into being careless with their children around their family dog - A recipe for dog bites!
Regarding Pits being "America's dog": Bronwen Dickey (author of incredibly biased and unscientific book "Pit Bull: The Battle over an American Icon") and other pit bull advocates argue that pit bulls were historically beloved in the U.S. until the dogs became associated with urban people of color in the 1970s, so Pit Bull stigma is really about being racist toward black and brown people.
But pit bulls were not historically beloved in the U.S. nor were they popularly regarded as a positive symbol of plucky can-do spirit. Joseph Colby, in his lifetime one of the world's leading authorities on the Pit Bull Terrier, wrote in 1936 that "The general public is under the impression that this breed is carnivorous, vicious, and, fed on a diet of raw meat, will devour a human being" and "When the pit bull terrier was introduced into America, he was more commonly found to be owned by prize fighters, saloon keepers and habitues, sporting men and the like. From the start the breed earned an unjust reputation due to his fighting ability and the character of the owner. To this day he is still trying to live down an unjust and undeserved reputation."
Sometimes Pit people will randomly mention how Sergeant Stubby, a decorated war hero dog, was a Pit Bull. He was not. Primary (contemporary) sources most often describe Stubby as a Boston Terrier or Boston Terrier mix (this breed was sometimes called the Boston Bulldog). He is sometimes said to be a Bull Terrier (the egghead dogs) mix but he obviously resembles a Boston Terrier significantly more than a Bull Terrier. Stubby is never said to be a Pit Bull in primary sources.

9. "Pit Bulls scored 2nd highest on temperament tests and better than most family dog breeds!"

This is always referring to the ATTS, or the American Temperament Testing Society. It is refuted thoroughly in the BanPitBulls FAQ, but this is what I usually say as well:
The test was developed to test working dogs, specifically dogs meant for schutzhund work. It has never been, nor ever purported to be about testing companion animals or a breed's suitability as family pets. Scoring actually favors dogs that bite, in some cases. Breed specific temperament, aggression, and each dog's training is taken into account when scoring. This means that if a relatively untrained Lab bites a "threatening stranger" it will score far lower than a German Shepherd that bites a "threatening stranger." According to the ATTS itself, "95% of dogs who fail do so because they lack confidence" NOT because they bite. Dogs that exhibit avoidance behaviors will fail. Dogs that bite do not automatically fail. The ATTS also states that comparing scores with other dogs means nothing- the pass/fail rates cannot be compared. Different dog breeds that behave the same exact way on the test will get hugely different scores due to the fact they take inherent breed tendencies into consideration. The test is not designed to test for breed aggression, according to the ATTS website. It is more of a test of bravery for individual dogs. Timid dogs will always fail. Dogs that bite will not always fail. If anything, you could argue that the reason Pits have a high passing rate is because they bite or show aggression, although that is speculation and not proven. Either way though- the test does not test breed aggression, passing rates cannot be compared, and the test absolutely does not test for suitability as a family pet. More info here: What the ATTS is really showing.
It is also worth mentioning that the only dogs that participate in the ATTS testing are dogs brought in by their owners- it is not a random sample or scientific study of any kind. Considering the evidence showing the existence of an actual Pit Bull lobby, it would not be a reach to say these results have been intentionally manipulated (if they did even matter, which they don't).
Also, a controlled temperament test found that 13 percent, or one out of seven, pit bulls tried to bite or attack during a one hour test simulating a neighborhood walk. One out of seven pit bulls tried to bite in the span of just one hour compared to only one out of 70 golden retrievers. Note that this study was funded and authored by anti-breed ban activists: They found "no significant difference" between breeds when the definition of aggression was watered down to include even whining or crying. But pay close attention to Table 5 on page 138: out of all the breeds tested, pit bulls were markedly the worst when it came to the percentage of dogs that reached a more serious level of aggression.

10. "It's racism for dogs!"

Humans are not dogs, and dog breeds are not analogous to human races.
In addition, one cannot compare a race of people to a breed of dogs for a multitude of reasons. Dog breeds were selectively, intentionally bred for specific characteristics and traits by human beings. Humans created dog breeds based on what physical and behavioral traits we wanted them to have. (Spaniels for flushing, retrievers for fetching prey/birds without damage, livestock guardian dogs such as Great Pyrenees for protecting livestock, Huskies for endurance and energy, Pointers for pointing, etc. Different dog breeds have different behavioral tendencies because humans selectively bred them to have those tendencies). Dogs also do not suffer from cultural differences, institutionalized racism, or socioeconomic disparities. Humans are also not as heavily influenced by our instincts as dogs are. Dogs behave based on their instincts and training. Humans behave mainly on their "training." Humans also have far more complex thought processes and the ability to make complex decisions. Dogs do not. You could go on and on but that is the basic overview there- dogs were selectively bred and rely mainly on their instincts. Humans were not selectively bred and are capable of making complex and rational decisions.
Post continued in the comments due to the character limit.
submitted by Rumored17 to BanPitBulls [link] [comments]


2020.09.15 23:29 Rumored17 Refutations for Every Main Pro-Pit Argument

1."It's all how you raise them."

And more:
• ⁠Lockwood, R. A. N. D. A. L. L. (2016). Ethology, ecology and epidemiology of canine aggression. The Domestic Dog: Its Evolution, Behaviour & Interactions with People,, 160-181.
• ⁠Abrantes, R., Site, A., Camp, S., Diving, F. A. Q., Camp, G. P., Pages, M., ... & User, C. C. (2016). Aggressive Behavior—Inheritance and Environment.
• ⁠van den Berg, L. I. N. D. A. (2016). Genetics of dog behavior. The Domestic Dog: Its Evolution, Behavior and Interactions with People, 5, 69.
• ⁠O'Neill, D. G., & Packer, R. M. (2016). The First Canine Behavior and Genetics Conference: Summary and recommendations for future directions in canine behavioral science. Journal of Veterinary Behavior, 16, 6-12.
• ⁠Sørensen, M. (2016). Breeding aggression: Review of recent literature concerning the influence of genes on aggressive behaviour (Doctoral dissertation).
• ⁠Schilder, M. B., van der Borg, J. A., & Vinke, C. M. (2019). Intraspecific killing in dogs: predation behavior or aggression? A study of aggressors, victims, possible causes and motivations. Journal of Veterinary Behavior.
These studies all show that genetics play a large role in dog behavior. Most are related to Pit Bulls or aggression, but some just show that there are noticeable differences between dog breeds based on their breed. Here are some anecdotal sources to support the claims that Pit Bulls are born with a tendency to be aggressive:
In addition, "it's all how you raise them" goes against the very existence of dog breeds. If someone is arguing this, they are saying a Labrador Retriever will have the same instincts as a Border Collie, which will have the same instincts as a Doberman, which will have the same instincts as a Great Pyrenees, which will have the same instincts as a Dachshund, etc. This is observably and demonstrably false. Humans created different dog breeds with different temperaments and physical and behavioral traits through selective breeding. This is why dog breeds exist, this is why breed standards exist, this is why people can reasonably and accurately predict how a dog will act based on breed. Are there exceptions? Of course. However, that is just what they are- exceptions. Different dog breeds have different traits and tendencies dependent on what they were selectively bred for.

2. "Chihuahuas are more aggressive."

This is just a disingenuous attempt to derail the conversation. Even if Chihuahuas are more aggressive, they don't/can't kill people. If Chihuahuas were as large as Pit Bulls, perhaps this would be a conversation worth having- seeing as this is not the case, there is no argument to be had here.
I try to emphasize that the issue with Pits is how many people and pets they kill. Pit Bulls are not just biting people- they are killing, severely maiming, and mauling people. There is a huge difference, and it is important to recognize many Pit fanatics will try to lump in all dog bites with the maulings Pit Bulls are responsible for. They are not the same. This is similar to the "Labs bite more" argument- again, we are not just talking about bites. Keep the discussion focused on severe maulings, maimings, and deaths, because that is what BSL targets.
From 1982-2020 no Chihuahua has ever killed anyone. This source breaks down attacks by breed, child or adult victim, and death or maiming.

3. "There's no such thing as a Pit Bull." and "Pit Bulls can't be identified."

A good way to avoid even getting to this apologist bingo point is by using the phrasing "Pit Bull type dogs" as opposed to Pit Bulls. However, you can also just explain that "Pit Bull" is an umbrella term for four closely related dog breeds- the American Pit Bull Terrier, the American Staffordshire Terrier, the Staffordshire Bull Terrier, and the American Bully. The American Pit Bull Terrier and the American Staffordshire Terrier are actually so similar they can be dual registered as an AmStaff with the AKC and a APBT with the UKC. Until recently, most dog DNA tests would not even separate AmStaff from APBT due to the extreme similarities. This is also just another deflection technique- everyone knows what someone means by "Pit Bull" just as everyone knows what someone means by "Golden Retriever." This is what "pit bull" means legally.
Now, because "Pit Bull" does refer to 4 dog breeds rather than one, Pit apologists will often cry "well of course 4 dog breeds will kill more people!" but keep in mind that these 4 dog breeds have killed more people than 300+ other dog breeds combined. The Pit Bull umbrella kills more people than every other group or type of dogs and more than every other dog breed combined.
Regarding Pit Bulls being unidentifiable:
Pit Bulls have just as many obvious identifying characteristics as other dog breeds. There is no reason to believe Pit Bulls suffer from misidentification more than other dog breeds. There is reason to believe Pit Bulls are intentionally mislabeled as other breeds when in shelters, however. In addition, when discussing fatal Pit Bull attacks specifically, more often than not there are photos of the Pit Bulls involved so anyone can verify for themselves if they were Pit Bull type dogs. Genetic testing is not required for breed identification- anyone who argues this is being disingenuous. Another point is that we are constantly inundated with Pro-Pit propaganda; there is simply no way we can have Pixar shorts such as Kitbull and a new Dodo video every week about Pit Bulls and still be expected to believe the average person cannot visually identify a Pit Bull.

4. Pits are no more dangerous than other dogs.

The statistics also support our side here- Pit Bulls have killed more people than all other dog breeds combined. Pit Bulls are not the largest, nor the strongest dogs out there. They do not have the strongest bite force. They are more deadly than other dog breeds because humans selectively bred them to be as deadly as possible. They are deadly due to the nature of their attacks and the behavioral traits they display when attacking such as gameness and a bite style mentioned in some of these studies, along with their physical traits.

5. "It used to be Dobermans, Rottweilers, and German Shepherds that people wanted to ban!"

Pit Bulls have killed more people than those three breeds ever did, even at the height of their popularity, even combined. There is also no evidence supporting this claim, and in fact, quite a lot of evidence showing it's completely false.
It is important to note as well that none of these breeds have an entire lobby supporting them. They do not have communities dedicated to attack victim harassment, misinformation, and lies, unlike the Pit Bull has. Something interesting to consider is the bias online when looking at these breeds and other restricted breeds vs pages about Pit Bulls. Wikipedia in particular is very obviously being manipulated by Pit Bull fanatics.
None of this manipulation is occurring on the pages for Dobermans, Rottweilers, or German Shepherds. These three breeds never reached anywhere close to the level of suffering and carnage Pit Bulls are responsible for. There has never been a concerted effort to ban these breeds, although some are targeted by apartment restrictions due to insurance issues. There is also no lobby supporting the misinformation and misrepresentation of these breeds.

6. "Dogsbite.org is biased and unreliable."

Dogsbite is completely open and transparent about their data collection strategies. They provide identification photographs and have all of their citations publicly listed. Citations and Photographs
Here is a challenge I like to give to people who claim Dogsbite is unreliable, although I have yet to receive a legitimate response:
Have you actually looked into dogsbite.org yourself? You do know that dogsbite tracks every fatal dog attack, regardless if it's a Pit or not? It appears anti-Pit because most fatal dog attacks are done by Pits. They're not only posting Pit attacks- there are just so many more fatal Pit attacks than other breeds it appears they are.
Here's a proposal for you:
Go to 2020 and late 2019, a time frame for which news reports are still abundantly available all over the internet, and fact-check ANY FOUR DOG-BITE FATALITIES OF YOUR CHOOSING, two where the killer dogs are said to be pit/mixes, and two cases where the killer dogs are not said to be pit/mixes:
  1. Did DogsBite accurately name the person killed?
  2. Did DogsBite accurately summarize the circumstances in which the person was killed?
  3. Did DogsBite accurately identify the breed(s) of the killer dog(s)?
  4. Did DogsBite provide a photo or photos of the killer dog(s) so you can judge for yourself what type of dog(s) you think did the killing?
DogsBite and Wikipedia both provide links to news stories about these fatal attacks. If you don't want to use the news links provided by DogsBite, then use the ones on Wikipedia that cover the same stories. DogsBite also provides links to autopsy reports, police reports and 911 calls, so you can compare these primary sources with the summaries on the DogsBite page and assess whether those summaries are accurate.

7. "Human aggressive Pit Bulls were culled!"

This is a myth. While human aggression was not something that was typically selectively bred for it is a myth that most human aggressive Pits were culled. That was not the case, and it still is not the case today. One look at shelter descriptions of Pits with bite histories and severe aggression issues shows these dogs are not being euthanized, and there are several instances of Pit Bulls who have killed people being bred.
There's no evidence whatsoever that dog fighters routinely destroyed human-aggressive dogs and refused to breed them. u/NorthTwoZero wrote at length about why it's a myth here, and this blogger put together a documented list of famously human-aggressive fighting dogs who not only weren't "culled" but were bred so often that they produced over 1,200 known, registered offspring:
"The man-biters were culled and the pit bulls were not bred for human aggression myths were created from thin air, complete fabrications. There is not a sliver of truth in the myth that dogmen culled man-biters. Not only weren't human aggressive pit fighters NOT culled, but a talented man-biter was heavily bred, his stud services were in high demand and the stud fees commanded a premium. The progeny of man-biters are still sought out long after he or she has passed away. This Italian game-dog website lists their choice for the Best Ever fighting dogs, three of the five are known man-biters and the other two trace their origins to the others on their "Best" list. Some famous man-biters have their own facebook fan pages. If you happen to be a 10x winner with 3 kills and scratching on the carcass, people tend to overlook a little thing like the danger she poses to people and she is also likely to be nominated for the cover of this month's International Sporting Dog Journal. Some famous man-biters not only have a facebook fan page, they have their own promotional merchandise too."

8. "Pit Bulls were nanny dogs!" or "Pit Bulls were America's dog!"

First, I usually ask questions that demonstrate out how absurd that claim is. What is a nanny dog? What duties does a nanny dog perform? Why would a dog type be called a "Pit Bull" if it nannied? Where does the name "Pit Bull" come from? Why is it necessary for Pits to have such large, gaping mouths and extremely muscular bodies if they were nannies? Then here is some actual info:
The first appearance of the term "Nanny Dog" dates from a 1971 NYT interview with the then president of the Staffordshire Bull Terrier Club of America, Lillian Rant, who called Staffordshire Bull Terriers "nursemaid dogs" for no apparent reason (other than to attempt to re-brand fighting dogs as family pets).
BAD RAP shared a link.
It's Dog Bite Prevention Week. Did you know that there was never such thing as a 'Nanny's Dog'? This term was a recent invention created to describe the myriad of vintage photos of children enjoying their family pit bulls (see link for details about vintage photos). While the intention behind the term was innocent, using it may mislead parents into being careless with their children around their family dog - A recipe for dog bites!
Regarding Pits being "America's dog": Bronwen Dickey (author of incredibly biased and unscientific book "Pit Bull: The Battle over an American Icon") and other pit bull advocates argue that pit bulls were historically beloved in the U.S. until the dogs became associated with urban people of color in the 1970s, so Pit Bull stigma is really about being racist toward black and brown people.
But pit bulls were not historically beloved in the U.S. nor were they popularly regarded as a positive symbol of plucky can-do spirit. Joseph Colby, in his lifetime one of the world's leading authorities on the Pit Bull Terrier, wrote in 1936 that "The general public is under the impression that this breed is carnivorous, vicious, and, fed on a diet of raw meat, will devour a human being" and "When the pit bull terrier was introduced into America, he was more commonly found to be owned by prize fighters, saloon keepers and habitues, sporting men and the like. From the start the breed earned an unjust reputation due to his fighting ability and the character of the owner. To this day he is still trying to live down an unjust and undeserved reputation."
Sometimes Pit people will randomly mention how Sergeant Stubby, a decorated war hero dog, was a Pit Bull. He was not. Primary (contemporary) sources most often describe Stubby as a Boston Terrier or Boston Terrier mix (this breed was sometimes called the Boston Bulldog). He is sometimes said to be a Bull Terrier (the egghead dogs) mix but he obviously resembles a Boston Terrier significantly more than a Bull Terrier. Stubby is never said to be a Pit Bull in primary sources.

9. "Pit Bulls scored 2nd highest on temperament tests and better than most family dog breeds!"

This is always referring to the ATTS, or the American Temperament Testing Society. It is refuted thoroughly in the BanPitBulls FAQ, but this is what I usually say as well:
The test was developed to test working dogs, specifically dogs meant for schutzhund work. It has never been, nor ever purported to be about testing companion animals or a breed's suitability as family pets. Scoring actually favors dogs that bite, in some cases. Breed specific temperament, aggression, and each dog's training is taken into account when scoring. This means that if a relatively untrained Lab bites a "threatening stranger" it will score far lower than a German Shepherd that bites a "threatening stranger."
According to the ATTS itself, "95% of dogs who fail do so because they lack confidence" NOT because they bite. Dogs that exhibit avoidance behaviors will fail. Dogs that bite do not automatically fail.
The ATTS also states that comparing scores with other dogs means nothing- the pass/fail rates cannot be compared. Different dog breeds that behave the same exact way on the test will get hugely different scores due to the fact they take inherent breed tendencies into consideration.
The test is not designed to test for breed aggression, according to the ATTS website. It is more of a test of bravery for individual dogs. Timid dogs will always fail. Dogs that bite will not always fail.
If anything, you could argue that the reason Pits have a high passing rate is because they bite or show aggression, although that is speculation and not proven. Either way though- the test does not test breed aggression, passing rates cannot be compared, and the test absolutely does not test for suitability as a family pet.
More info here: What the ATTS is really showing.
It is also worth mentioning that the only dogs that participate in the ATTS testing are dogs brought in by their owners- it is not a random sample or scientific study of any kind. Considering the evidence showing the existence of an actual Pit Bull lobby, it would not be a reach to say these results have been intentionally manipulated (if they did even matter, which they don't).
Also, a controlled temperament test found that 13 percent, or one out of seven, pit bulls tried to bite or attack during a one hour test simulating a neighborhood walk. One out of seven pit bulls tried to bite in the span of just one hour compared to only one out of 70 golden retrievers. Note that this study was funded and authored by anti-breed ban activists: They found "no significant difference" between breeds when the definition of aggression was watered down to include even whining or crying. But pay close attention to Table 5 on page 138: out of all the breeds tested, pit bulls were markedly the worst when it came to the percentage of dogs that reached a more serious level of aggression.

10. "It's racism for dogs!"

Humans are not dogs, and dog breeds are not analogous to human races.
In addition, one cannot compare a race of people to a breed of dogs for a multitude of reasons. Dog breeds were selectively, intentionally bred for specific characteristics and traits by human beings. Humans created dog breeds based on what physical and behavioral traits we wanted them to have. (Spaniels for flushing, retrievers for fetching prey/birds without damage, livestock guardian dogs such as Great Pyrenees for protecting livestock, Huskies for endurance and energy, Pointers for pointing, etc. Different dog breeds have different behavioral tendencies because humans selectively bred them to have those tendencies). Dogs also do not suffer from cultural differences, institutionalized racism, or socioeconomic disparities. Humans are also not as heavily influenced by our instincts as dogs are. Dogs behave based on their instincts and training. Humans behave mainly on their "training." Humans also have far more complex thought processes and the ability to make complex decisions. Dogs do not. You could go on and on but that is the basic overview there- dogs were selectively bred and rely mainly on their instincts. Humans were not selectively bred and are capable of making complex and rational decisions.
Post continued in the comments due to the character limit.
submitted by Rumored17 to BanPitBulls [link] [comments]


2020.09.14 08:52 TheAtomicEsquire LEVIATHAN Rising: A Spacedy Pleblore Project [Part I: Intro and ZE GERMANS]

Introduction to LEVIATHAN Rising: A Spacedy Pleblore Project
So, what is all this then? It is the out-of-control Kudzu Worldbuilding of a bona fide space cadet who simply loves trying to answer narrative questions about "how?" and "why?". Though that doesn't answer much. Probably best to start at the beginning.
LEVIATHAN Rising began as a submod idea for adding Space Race content for the other American presidents who are not John Glenn. It wasn't long before I could see that that was never going to happen, because I had no idea how to make my ideas mechanically meaningful nor any no good reason why, if I was just writing a story, why it had to be in HoI4 rather than a medium which didn't require me to learn to do some coding. It's since grown a bit in scope since then, with the goal of trying to reasonably detailed and (hopefully) workable space programs that are each unique and interesting in their own way.
The initial target of the project is to produce four installments -- like the one below -- addressing the origins up to 1962 of the space programs of the four nations that either are supposed to be part of the Space Race or who have events that establish them as having a mature launching capability: Germany, Japan, the United States, and Italy. (I will probably break my own rule and take Italy past 1962, as it's the odd duck whose becoming a space-launching power is the one that occurs in-game.) That should provide, at the very least, a resource for anyone who might be pondering these questions themselves and maybe even provide some inspiration to someone.
Whether I finish is another question entirely. And given that we haven't even gotten to the titular LEVIATHAN Plan yet, well...
Part I: Those Stupid Jetpack Nazis and a (Not So) Brief History of Der Mondflug
The Origins of the Ten-Year Plan and Reichsparteitag Mission Architecture
Unlike its American and Japanese counterparts, the origins of the German space program can be traced directly to the actions of just two men: Werner von Braun and Hermann Goering. The former, the father of the German ballistic missile program, had always seen his work at Peenemunde as merely a first-step on the long road towards mankind’s expansion into the great expanse beyond our world. Braun would never be shy about evangelizing on the subject of space or using the immense pool of aeronautical talent assembled over the years at Peenemunde to tackle the problems associated with sending men to the stars. This penchant for, as the Heer’s and Luftwaffe’s mandarins called it, “misappropriating official resources” earned him no kudos with the military bureaucracies, who in turn were apt to write-off his calls for a lunar expedition as a fool’s errand as much because of the proposer as the proposal itself.
Sometimes, however, only one friend is necessary, if sufficiently high-ranking. And there were few men higher-ranking in the Reich than Hermann Goering. Spaceflight, by its very nature, spoke to Goering’s technophilic sensibilities and love of great machines doing even greater works. The exploration of space would also give the Luftwaffe a new frontier of its own to conquer, a project on the scale of Atlantropa or the colonization of the Slavic East, at a time when the German air force was distinctly lacking an animating mission beyond strafing untermenschen for fun and profit. So it was that, in May 1952, Goering requested that Braun conduct a design study on the feasibility of placing a man on the Moon by the end of 1963. Goering further requested that, if such was possible, Braun develop a plan for doing so which could be presented at the 23rd Reichsparteitag (Party Congress) the September of the coming year. The Reichsmarschall also promised Braun all necessary support in obtaining a “favorable report”.
With Goering’s backing, Braun finally had the freedom and resources to tackle the task he had wanted to for his entire professional life. And tackle it he and his team at Peenemunde did. In just under nine months, they produced An Introductory Primer on and Ten-Year Proposal for a Lunar Mission, an eight-volume, 3,000-page report that was equal-measures high-concept study and mission reference document. Braun confidently predicted that the Reich could land a man on the Moon by 1963 and outlined his steps for a lunar expedition:
1) Developing a three-stage Earth Ferry Shuttle (“EFS”) to provide access to orbit, with each stage being piloted and returning to the launch site after deployment of the payload, allowing each stage to be refurbished and reused;
2) Building a Large Space Station (“LASS”) in near-Earth orbit, to gain experience in building things in orbit in space, provide an environment to learn how humans adapt to zero-g, and provide a jumping-off point for the eventual lunar expedition;
3) Assembling a fleet of three Moonships at the LASS from payloads boosted into orbit by several squadrons of EFSes. The combined payload of the Moonship fleet would be 50 people and 250 tonnes of payload.
4) Mounting the expedition when the Moonships are built and their crews delivered from Earth. The expedition will spend 6-8 weeks on the surface of the Moon, before returning to the LASS via the Moonships.
Bold and ambitious, The Ten-Year Proposal represented more than a decade of accumulated watercooler discussions, off-topic thought exercises, and piecemeal research, plus half-a-year of frantic design work by a half-dozen newly created working groups. Its attempt to be a comprehensive treatment of the subject were admirable, though its eclectic breadth and wildly varying levels of detail attested to where the specialties of the team at Peenemunde were, with the most work going into the sections related to rocketry. (More esoteric topics addressed included the mechanical difficulties of using the bathroom in non-standard gravities, the potential inclusion of ships’ pets for morale purposes on a long and dangerous journey, and theoretical considerations for human reproduction beyond Earth’s magnetosphere.)
The Ten-Year Proposal was everything that Goering had asked for, and more much more besides. A draft was prepared for circulation to the Fuhrer – removing, for example, such potentially seditious discussions of human sexual relations on the Moon – for his approval, which came immediately. Hitler’s interest was so stimulated that it was decided that the theme of the 23rd Rechisparteitag would be “The New Order on All Worlds”, celebrating the twin great works of National Socialism: The forging of the new continent Atlantropa and Germany’s impending conquest of the heavens themselves. By the 33rd Reichsparteitag, it was to be announced, there would be a swastika on the Moon!
And so, with the Fuhrer’s blessing came the resources of a continent, as the Reich’s bottomless reserves of capital, both fiscal and intellectual, were furnished to make the dream of a man on the Moon a reality. Neither Braun nor Goering had given much thought to the seemingly mundane task of naming the program that would take on a life of its own over the next decade. That came in September 1953, when the Fuhrer, in his dedication of the Reich Institute on Spaceflight at Peenemunde (RIS), stated: “The Ten-Year Program, carried out with wondrous machines of the sort shown to the Reichsparteitag, is a sacred duty and obligation entrusted to you. And there is no higher calling than performing such duties and fulfilling such obligations.”
And in the language of the Reich, the Fuhrer’s message was equally clear: The Ten-Year Program and Reichsparteitag Architecture would succeed. Failure was not an option. At least if the Ten-Year Program’s leadership wanted enough of themselves left for their families to bury.
“Die Glückliche Zeit”: Excelsior and Pride Goeth
Veterans of Peenemunde – both before and after the formation of the RIS -- would recall the period from the middle of 1953 until the start of 1957 as the “Happy Time”, when life was good from the seemingly infinite budgets and near-daily breakthroughs as Peenemunde became the site of the greatest scientific endeavor of the age. Werner von Braun had been named RIS Director at its founding and, at the helm of a major national project blessed by the Fuhrer himself, bestrode the political scene like a colossus. It was a time of Olympian propositions, in which nothing could not be done if the RIS just put its mind to doing it. Of course – as Dr. Heinz Schlicke never tired of reminding his new colleagues – the “Happy Time” that was being paid homage to ended rather badly for the Kriegsmarine, and emulating would not be desirable.
Contrarians like Schlicke aside, Braun happily counted himself as one of the contented at RIS. Everything was by no means perfect, as the start of the Happy Time was bookended by the young program’s first major security breach. Three months before the Institute’s founding, it was discovered – rather embarrassingly – that somehow the CIA had gotten ahold of a copy of The Ten-Year Proposal, when detailed (and nominally highly classified) technical diagrams appeared in a Collier’s article entitled “Man Will Conquer Space Soon!”. The resulting organizational debriefing by the SD was not pleasant, but for the whole of the Happy Time that followed, the Ten-Year Program’s contact with the Reich’s security services was incidental and nonintrusive, which was about as much as could be hoped for given the amount of public money and classified information were involved.
Work on the design of the EFS, LASS, and Moonships occurred in parallel from the inauguration of the RIS into 1955. The center of the project remained the EFS, to be powered by the Ragnarok family of rocket engines, from – as one junior engineer put it – “the feeling that the world is ending when they’re fired.” The first-stage would be powered by between five and seven of these R-1s, with each generating 750,000kgf of thrust. The second-stage would use a variant tuned for specific impulse rather than thrust, while the third would use smaller-still variants for final ascent and in-orbit maneuvers. Payload was expected to be 40 tonnes to LEO.
As it evolved, the EFS simplified in conception: The boosting stages became unmanned and, while work remained ongoing to make them fully reusable, the brutal time-table mandated by the Ten-Year Plan brought about a working assumption that least the first production models would be expendable. The third-stage, meanwhile, evolved into a spaceplane -- the Planetary Descent Orbiter (“PLADO”) -- due to the easier technical hurdles to clear as opposed to its originally envisioned tail-sitter configuration. These changes were, on the whole, to be expected as this sort of highly experimental project evolved. By March 1955, the EFS was complete enough to begin building assembly prototypes, as the testing on the various engines to be used was already underway.
While the Ten-Year Program’s principal booster was sorting itself out, it became increasingly necessary to sort-out the greatest physical impairment to the Reichsparteitag Architecture’s success. Quite simply, the existing facilities at Peenemunde were grossly insufficient for the task envisioned and basic geography prohibited it from ever being an appropriate launch-site. Situated at more than 54°N Latitude, its orbital inclination was useless and consumed precious delta-v performing maneuvers to reach equatorial orbits. Further, its launch corridor took rockets flying over the Reich and Ostland as they ascended, unless further in-flight maneuvers were carried out to track the Baltic, which further ate into payload capacity. If the Ten-Year Plan was to stay on schedule, a new launch site would need built.
Braun outlined the needs to Goering for a launch site that was compliant with the vehicles of the Reichsparteitag Architecture. What was ideally needed was a place near the Equator with coastal access to an expansive body of water to its east. Goering believed that either of Reichskommisariats Ostafrika or Madagaskar would likely have a suitable location. As the Foreign Ministry was briefed on the need to handle the diplomatic niceties, a rather unexpected turn of events occurred: They had a counterproposal! Both the Foreign Ministry and Ministry of Industry had long sought to foster greater scientific and economic cooperation within the Einheitspakt. And, in light of Mediterranean – specifically Italian – discontent owing to the Atlantropa Projects, that the Ten-Year Program’s needs provided an opportunity to kill three birds with one stone. As the Equator runs through Italian East Africa and the Somalian coast has a number of sparsely populated ports eminently suitable appropriation. Extending such a prestigious honor would also do much to placate the Italians and provide a nexus for scientific cooperation between all of the nations of the Einheitspakt. Goering’s violent reaction to this “Speerite subterfuge” did little to scupper the Foreign Ministry’s proposal, which was elevated to the Fuhrer for consideration. And, much to the Reichsmarschall’s chagrin, it was approved over his objections.
Much of the next eighteen months would be spent building the Goering International Space Center in Hermannstadt – as the port of Kismayo was renamed in a concession to assuage Goering’s wounded pride – in equatorial Somaliland. The joint Italo-German enterprise would consume, by most estimates, a billion Reichsmarks to build the most expansive spaceport in the world in one of the most underdeveloped corners of the world and on a taxing schedule, as everything in the Ten-Year Program was. The Goering Space Center was officially inaugurated on December 17, 1956, with the shakedown launch of the first all-up A17 “Loki” rocket. Composed of two stages, the A17 was powered by a single R-1 engine in its first-stage and a single R-2 in its second, representing the first flying accomplishment of the Ten-Year Plan.
1957: The Year of the Black Sun
The beginning of 1957 buzzed with the news that the Space Race was finally heating up: After half-a-decade or more of talking about going into space, technology had matured enough to actually allow attempts to be made. Both Japan and the United States were allegedly to be sprinting to be the first to orbit an artificial satellite, which was believed to be capable of happening as soon as the summer. For the RIS, such notions were quaint, as the Reich had no such plans. After all, why should the world’s premiere space program be concerned with the lobbing of a few dozen kilograms of electronics into orbit when it was planning on to send a man into orbit and bring him back in a capsule massing thousands of kilograms? And to launch such by the last week of February, no less?
There was, indeed, a confidence that permeated Peenemunde that the uncharitable might have considered hubris. Certainly no one noticed sudden spike in missed deliveries from contractors as winter 1956 gave way the new year. Nor was any heed given to the alleged murmurings of friends and loved-ones in RK Moskowien about ominous rumblings from the Russian Wastes. But when a summons came from Germania, summoning the RIS Director to brief Goering on the status of the Ten-Year Program’s finances, it was clear that something was deeply, deeply troubling was going on.
For, as of January 25, 1957, no one at RIS knew the exact state of the finances of the Reichsparteitag Mission Architecture or the Ten-Year Program. They were projects blessed by Fuhrer: With such things, requests – or demands – were made for whatever was needed to accomplish them, and that was invariably produced if the security services or Heer was not to be involved. What monies were involved were always handled later on RIS’s behalf by the Luftwaffe or other governmental functionaries who were, in general, loathe to discuss such with Institute personnel.
With no small amount of trepidation, Braun and a team from RIS made their way to Germania. And were shellshocked when they were informed that the Fuhrer had, in light of the Reich’s many earthbound concerns, determined that the Ten-Year Program was not a worthwhile investment of the Reich’s resources. Which was why it had been decreed that the RIS would suspend all operations related to the Reichsparteitag Architecture effective immediately and prepare a detailed report on the most cost-effective way to accomplish the Ten-Year Program’s core goal of placing a man on the Moon by the end of 1963. Braun protested vociferously that, if there were concerns about the value of the work being done, a mere six weeks would be enough time to demonstrate its worth to the Fuhrer. Goering, however, brooked no objection, just as the Fuhrer had when Goering had lobbied him for precisely what Braun wanted. And if anyone did have problem with that, he’d ensure they were issued a rifle and sent to Moscowien to die in the snow fighting Soviet remnants.
And thus a thick malaise descended upon the RIS, as efforts that should have been focused on beginning manned flights were forcibly rerouted into inventorying what might salvageable from the Ten-Year Program, if it was salvageable at all. Gone were the LASS and Moonships, as they required far too much mass – and cost too much besides – to keep. So too was PLADO, for without the LASS to fabricate, what purpose was served with a big and heavy spaceplane cutting into orbital throw-weight? The Ten-Year Program, if it was to put on a man on the Moon, would have to embrace cramming men into tiny spacecraft “like spam in a can”, as the baleful lament went. The Loki at least guaranteed a working base for boosting payloads and the A20 “Thor” – the full-stack of the EFS – had been expected to be ready for preliminary full-up trials by the first-quarter of 1958 with a third-stage that provided a simple ballistic return capsule while the PLADO had finished prototyping. A low-energy, low-payload (“LELOP”) manned mission with a time on the surface measured in hours was probably technically feasible within the timeframes available.
The LELOP concept evolved into what was deemed a workable design for a three-man mission, assembling a moonship in orbit, consisting of two components, each lofted into a parking orbit as the third-stage of a Thor: The Lunar Transit Rocket (“LUTR”) and a Lunar Expeditionary Ascender-Descender (“LEAD”). The crew would ascend into space aboard the LUTR and, upon reaching orbit, dock with the waiting LEAD that had previously been launched. The moonship would then boost to the Moon, where two of the crewmen would transfer to the LEAD and detach, making a powered soft-landing on the Moon. At the completion of the lunar activities, the two men on the surface of the Moon would board the Ascender capsule of the LEAD, detach it from the Descender landing system, and boost back into orbit, where it would dock with the orbiting LUTR. The reunified moonship would then boost for Earth, where the crew of the spacecraft would board the Ascender capsule and detach from the LUTR, engage in a kick-down maneuver into the atmosphere for aerobraking, and splash-down with the Ascender capsule somewhere in the Atlantic.
Determining that not all hope was lost should have been a cause for cautious optimism; the more irrationally exuberant might have even hoped that the thoroughness with which RIS had embraced its mandate might earn it goodwill with the Fuhrer sufficient to not have to make all of the cuts contemplated. As the RIS’s progress was being inventoried, however, it became increasingly clear the scale of the crisis in which the Reich was embroiled, as the Berlin Stock Market collapsed on Black Monday leading to a financial meltdown that destroyed the Reichsmark and soon contaminated the whole economy. While, within the fortnight, word arrived that the latest resurgent Soviet remnant – the West Russian Revolutionary Front – had declared war against RK Moscowien and launched a general winter offensive from the Arctic to the Caspian. With the domestic situation in freefall as winter turned to spring, it was clear that there would be no salvation of the Reichsparteitag Mission Architecture. The only question was whether the Fuhrer would see fit to allow for the Valkyrie Program – as the LELOP mission design was styled – would be given permission to resume.
The Report on the State of the Ten-Year Lunar Program was transmitted to Germania in April. It would sit until October, when Germania found itself in the dire predicament of not only being in a Space Race, but having fallen behind, with the Japanese Asagataningen-1 becoming the world’s first artificial satellite. The crisis precipitated by the Asagataningen-1, however, was in short-order swept away by the Reich’s announcement shortly thereafter of its intent to impound all further payments to and from the Einheitspakt’s Atlantropa Adaptation & Mitigation Fund, sparking a diplomatic rupture with the Iberians and Italians, which culminated in the dramatic withdrawal of the Iberian Union and Italian Empire from the Einheitspakt. And, disastrously for the German space program, the seizure and nationalization of the Goering Space Center.
As 1957 drew to a close, the German space program had been brought to its knees as the Reich was gripped by a wave of crises not seen in decades. But the lunar program had endured the year’s body blows. That was more than can be said for many ambitious projects – including the Atlantropa Projects themselves – and would, hopefully, prove to be enough.
By Hook or Crook: Valkyrie Ascendant
As 1958 commenced, the Valkyrie Program was in a shambles. Much of the Reichsparteitag Architecture it had meant to build on was in disarray, as contractors had moved onto new projects over the past year and key personnel, such as the original astronaut class that had been selected, were reassigned back to line service with the Luftwaffe. To say nothing of the total loss of the physical infrastructure that had been built specifically for the Ten-Year Program, as the Italians steadfastly claimed the Goering Space Center and its half-dozen Loki rockets in various states of assembly and the prototype full-up Thor as “compensation” for the Reich’s refusal to honor its obligations from the Atlantropa Adaptation & Mitigation Fund.
The news was not all bad, however. Desperate fighting had, over the winter, appeared to check the West Russian Revolutionary Front before the gates of Moscow. And the Russians’ withdrawal had turned into a rout as the WRRF disintegrated as the web of alliances between its various warlords came undone in the retreat. That would mean, in theory, there could once more be a pool of suitable astronaut candidates. But that meant little without a place to launch from: Either a suitable replacement complex would have to be built or there would have to be significant modification of the facilities at Peenemunde, to say nothing of the changes needed to vehicle design to accommodate the atrocious inclination angle.
Ironically, it would be the Foreign Ministry that would put forward a possible solution to the problem that, for many at RIS, was their fault to begin with. With the “West Russian War” over – or at the very least with the Soviets effectively scattered and incapable of offensive action– the Reich needed to reassure the world that it remained a superpower. A significant international construction program was just what was needed! And, given the disposition of the political leadership of RK Ostafrika, a show of goodwill and the Fuhrer’s primacy was necessary after Himmler’s abortive coup to ensure the RK remained in the fold. The Foreign Ministry could ensure that the resources were found to build at least a minimally satisfactory launch site if it were to be situated in RK Ostafrika. And, from the last time the subject was raised, Pemba Island in Zanzibar was considered a suitable site! Whatever skepticism Braun might’ve had was assuaged by the reassurance that Reichskommisar Huttig can be very…convincing when it comes to motivating the local workforce to meet deadlines. And the grim fact that the challenges of shipping rockets around the Cape of Good Hope to Zanzibar is still significantly less complicated than trying to make a lunar mission launched from Peenemunde work.
With the promise of a new launch site and renewed funding, the Valkyrie Program finally could begin putting its house in order. Had Braun and the rest of the RIS leadership known much of America’s national pastime, they would have concurred that 1958 promised to be a “rebuilding year”, even if their overly optimistic plans held. It had been hoped that a crash modification of one of the launch pads at Peenemunde, as well as upgrading the mission control suite, could be completed by July and allow the formal commencement of the manned Space Operations and Skills Project (“SOSP”) that had been delayed since the suspension of the Ten-Year Program. SOSP had been intended to be the first steps of learning how to operate in orbit and start acquiring the skills necessary to build the LASS; it would still be needed even with Valkyrie’s much less grandiose plan, which still called for several orbital dockings in both Earth and lunar orbits.
As it was, the economic waves caused by collapse of the Reichsmark and the removal of some of Europe’s most productive industrial zones by the creation of the Ordenstaat Burgund meant that it would be well into 1959 before the necessary modifications were made to Peenemunde to handle the launch of the Loki rocket which was intended to be used for SOSP missions. The delays imposed by the modifications to Peenemunde were, in their own way, a blessing: They allowed the drag-chute to be pulled and RIS, as an institution, to fully acclimate itself to the Valkyrie Program and conduct some badly needed operational planning relating to it, when previously most of the work done amounted to taking the relevant bits of the Ten-Year Program and/or Reichspartei Architecture and then attempting to repurpose them on the fly. The full mission reference document for the Valkyrie Program was finally written-up and a full launch time-table for SOSP was developed, with 16 SOSP flights between 1959 and 1963, as well as six flights – manned and unmanned -- shaking down an otherwise full-up Thor mission-stack, with a tentative lunar mission date to coincide with the 33rd Reichsparteitag, much to the delight of both the Fuhrer and Goering.
Unfortunately for the Valkyrie Program, it would not be allowed to keep its footing for long. For despite having finally developed a feasible operational plan for reaching its objectives and actively moving into terrestrial field testing of all major subsystems to achieve those objectives, it was due to once more be beset by the Reich’s tumultuous politics. On April 12, 1959, the Reich once more found itself upstaged in the Space Race, when the United States’ Pioneer 1 succeeded in making John Glenn the first man to orbit the Earth. This was the second time that the Reich had been humiliated in a field that, by all rights, should belong to the Aryan race. There was no active war or acute economic crisis to blame this embarrassment on this time. It could, in the Fuhrer’s learned judgment, only be the fault of the management of the Valkyrie Program. A way must be found to restore the Reich’s honor. And, to ensure that sufficient motivation was had by both the Luftwaffe and RIS, the SS would be conducting a top-to-bottom audit of the program to identify potential areas for improvement.
The SS’s audit, despite its ominousness, was surprisingly gentle on the Valkyrie Program, finding that no meaningful changes could be made in the mission architecture to facilitate a faster Moon-landing. (Just where the SS found a pool of spaceflight experts not associated with RIS was, unfortunately, not one of the topics remarked upon.) What the audit did recommend was a radical restructuring of the finalized mission calendar, finding – based upon comparable American and Japanese protocols – that a mere six SOSP launches should be necessary, as well as a manned full-up test of the Thor followed by the launching of the lunar mission. If done, and the New Equatorial Launch Site on Pemba Island became available by July 1961, the program could have an Aryan on the Moon by the end of that same year. The Valkyrie team objected strenuously to what it perceived as wanton corner-cutting with the lives of German astronauts, to which the SS auditors merely recommended that, if the Luftwaffe could not find astronaut-candidates willing to trust the engineering prowess of the Aryan race with their lives, the SS certainly could. Even more distressingly, the Fuhrer adopted the recommendation, ordering the recommended adjustments to the mission calendar under threat of transfer of the whole Valkyrie Program to the SS.
The rest of 1959 and the whole of 1960 would prove to be reminiscent of an earlier, happier time at the RIS, before the dreams of the Ten-Year Plan were shattered by the Year of the Black Sun. Work proceeded steadily as the first four SOSP missions were flown, final ground-testing was completed on the rebuilt Thor prototypes and the Valkyrie moonship was deemed ready for man-rating. As the finish line was increasingly within view, however, the question of what came next haunted the corridors of power at RIS. Because of the long lead-time on certain key items, especially things like large rocket engines, potentially years of foreknowledge and planning would be necessary to keep RIS’s production pipeline flowing. As early as the dark days of 1957, the question of what would come after the first lunar landing was being investigated by an Ad Hoc Committee on Future Manned Missions, with the general conclusion of RIS that while the adaptation of the original Reichsparteitag Architecture to the systems created by the Valkyrie Program and continued pursuit of the Ten-Year Plan was the best course of action, at the very least a continued program of lunar exploration was required if only to justify the immense sums invested in both the Ten-Year and Valkyrie Programs, as well as better define future requirements and needs for manned spaceflight beyond Earth and its immediate environs. Both the Goering, however, flatly rejecting financing for further Valkyrie Program mission-planning for at least a period of at least 18 months after the first lunar landing, though the flying of smaller Loki-based missions were not prohibited.
That another funding cliff loomed was disappointing, but by no means was it even one of the five-worst faced by RIS since the inauguration of the Ten-Year Plan. Thankfully, while the Luftwaffe had curtailed the flight-testing program for Thor, there had been no cancellation of the four Thors on order for the cancelled test-flights. The production lines for the Reich’s heavy-lifter could, with a little creative structuring, be kept open during the moratorium on Valkyrie mission-planning. Given that the Valkyrie Program had already had to restart the Thor production line once already, avoiding having to deal with the arduousness of that again would save the program headaches in the future, should the political climate change and allow for more ambitious spacefaring.
1961 brought further delays to SOSP-5 and SOSP-6, though in a pleasant change of pace, for positive reasons. For a given definition of “positive”, at any rate. RK Ostafrika announced to the Foreign Ministry that it had completed the New Equatorial Launch Site a full three months ahead of schedule and would be ready to christen it in mid-April. The whole world, unfortunately, knew that the New Equatorial Launch Site was ahead of schedule, as the rather loud murmurings about the hellacious treatment of the native workforce building the Site were noteworthy for the intensity of the alleged brutality, even by the rather disturbing standards of Reichskommisar Huttig’s fiefdom. Nonetheless, juggling the schedule to allow SOSP-5 and -6 to launch from the Frederick Barbarossa National Launch Complex – as the Fuhrer insisted on naming it – would allow for greater acclimation to the facilities prior to the all-up manned Thor flight. Such juggling would prove invaluable, as the breaking in of Barbarossa National would throw back the flight of Valkyrie 5 from an initial mid-July launch to a mid-October one.
What is most amazing about the Barbarossa National break-in missions – SOSP-5, SOSP-6, and Valkyrie 5 – was not that they were as successful as they were, but rather that they were successful at all, given under the crushing schedule and active mandating of cutting corners from on-high. With a recipe for a massive explosion on the launchpad, the break-in missions not only didn’t get anyone killed, but functioned well enough to be called successes. It would be, for many at RIS, their finest professional moment and a testament to the thoroughness of German engineering. Less charitable – and almost invariably American or Japanese – engineers would also note the rather healthy amount of luck involved, given the risks taken. And that observation would not be incorrect, either.
Valkyrie 5 would set a record for the longest continuous presence in orbit, at just under 45 man-days for the three-man crew, as a whole lunar transit was simulated while orbiting Earth. At the conclusion of the mission, Braun advocated for allowing the more or less fully-loaded Valkyrie 5 to remain in orbit, in the hope that it might serve as the basis for a low-cost second Moon mission at some point in early 1962. As on the subject of mission-planning, he was overruled, though this time on the basis of national security, as it was unknown whether another mission would be mounted and a more or less fully intact Valkyrie would be a tempting espionage for the other superpowers. When the Ascender capsule detached and kicked into the atmosphere, a kick-down burn was remotely engaged, plunging the whole of Valkyrie 5 into an orbit that would see its burning wreckage scattered across several dozen square kilometers of the Indian Ocean.
The rest of 1961 would be spent going over the technical data gathered from the full-up dress rehearsal flight and ironing out what glitches remained. The accumulation of delays led to the amended mission calendar’s original launch date of December 20, 1961 – which would have placed a man on the Moon during the Winter Solstice – to slip. But all systems appeared to be go for Valkyrie 6 to lift-off on January 1, 1962, to ring in the new year with a demonstration of the Reich’s long-fermenting capability to dominate space…
Author's Comments
TNO is a mod that loves its alternative history to rhyme. That is, for story beats (such as historical events) to happen in ways or at times which evoke OTL, but which are nonetheless creatures of the allohistorical work. I'll admit that I just couldn't help going whole-hog with the rhyming history here. I blame the fact that the rocket in the New Start screen is very obviously a Totally Not Saturn V, even though that makes precious little sense in context.
For those who are not as unheathily familiar with the history of space exploration as I am, let me explain. Most of what's discussed here is, in fact, 100% OTL with the roles inverted. Between 1952 and 1954, Werner von Braun wrote a series of articles for Collier's magazine -- the first, of course, being called "Man Will Conquer Space Soon!" -- that featured a lavish vision of an expedition to the Moon, and a process to get there consisting of building a rocket with a reusable spaceplane final stage, which would build a space station in orbit, that would assemble a fleet of moonships to take a massive expedition to the Moon. He found no real support for his ambitions, but did eventually get a job putting a man on the Moon, though the Apollo Program was a radically different beast with radically different philosophies than the Collier's project.
At any rate, here, Braun gets an infinitely deep pocket to build his Collier's project, and then, when forced to pare himself back to...Apollo, as Loki is the Totally Not Saturn I(b), Thor the Totally Not Saturn V, LUTR the Totally Not Apollo Command and Service Module, and LEAD the Totally Not Lunar Module. The guy just can't catch a break in either timeline.
If I Were A Rich Man Deep One Modder...
Consider this an idea that would make an interesting submod unto itself, but for which I certainly don't have the skill or chops to create. Who knows, maybe someone will get some mileage out of it.
Reichskommisariat Raketeland
Following the onset of the German Civil War, many RIS members -- including its director -- fled the Reich for Pemba Island in RK Ostafrika in the hopes of finding a safe port in a raging storm. While the Afrika-Schild was embroiled in its war with South Africa, Pemba Island was far removed from the fronts and OFN aircraft gave wide berth to the Barbarossa National Launch Complex, lest a provocation be caused that might draw the ire of the Reich. With the war drawing ever-more of RK Ostafrika's resources southward, Pemba Island is increasingly left to govern itself, and with a well-established leadership hierarchy from RIS and a battalion of regular Luftwaffe Fallschirm-Panzergrenadiers, it might just be able to do so/
submitted by TheAtomicEsquire to TNOmod [link] [comments]


2020.09.06 19:25 Torn-TheArchitect Why FAU-G is a HOAX? From the perspective of European AAA game developer.

Why FAU-G is a HOAX? From the perspective of European AAA game developer.
I know there is a huge discussion around this "Project". Also controversy that PUBG was banned, and now this thing is being produced. I needed to share my thoughts about this as a AAA game developer.
When a serious game company decides to reveal information about their project they show a teaser that will 'sell' the mood of the game, setting, gameplay, etc. depending of how advanced the production is. Even when is not much to show, they have game design document, rough prototypes of mechanics. One is sure, no real gamedev company uses bought stock content to promote their game.
And here we begin - a Twitter post ( https://twitter.com/vishalgondal/status/1301822102471811074?s=19 ).

https://preview.redd.it/bahrimqoakl51.png?width=585&format=png&auto=webp&s=ca4e45b525bcedbcae13315d467507507914ad40
There is absolutely no information about the game. There is one word "Action Game" which can define games from Pac Man to Mortal Kombat. Also from other twitter posts we can learn that game will teach about "sacrifices of our soldiers". I guess it's about sacrifices of Indian soldiers - so... it is perfectly normal to make a teaser poster of game with stock photo of American Soldiers ( www.shutterstock.com/image-photo/battle-military-war-troops-smoke-1045196350 ). There is also a word "soon" - we will get to that later.
EDIT: Why this poster thing is important to me? Let me give you an example.
Last year ISRO has launched succesfully Chandrayaan2. Can you imagine that the first information about this project would be a post on Twitter with a photograph of american rocket with poorly Photoshoped India flag? It will be a shitstorm. So why it is okay to do the same for a game? Let's be serious and threat target audience seriously.
So how we know it will be a PUBG clone?

https://preview.redd.it/kvdcey7pakl51.png?width=583&format=png&auto=webp&s=acf80bd70ccac09b82c8170da48db8041a970507
And that's all info relating to PUBG. But lets assume FAU-G will be actually a PUBG clone.
EDIT: It turned out The trailer is probably fake material posted on ncore games YouTube channel. Probably it's not official site. I will still put it in spoiler tag if anyone wants to see it anyway.
After the teaser poster comes TRAILER uploaded at nCORE Games youtube channel ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXv2jazfXT0 )

https://preview.redd.it/9pe81qppakl51.png?width=1203&format=png&auto=webp&s=a76597d75eddba20e3ca4dfc55deb1133089b335
And what happened? From modern time USA we jumped to Second World War, in Europe. There is European architecture from those times, guns, vehicles, etc. And people are talking in Polish there ( I was surprised to hear my mother language in Indian game trailer, and this made me intrigued. And here I am, disappointed ). BTW HALT means STOP in German.
Conclusions for now - nCORE Games, has absolutely no content and no idea how the game should and will look like. They use stock materials to promote non existing project.
Let's move on and assume they actually know what game they are making. So we will see the Company Portfolio, just to see if they can deliver. " nCore Games - Leading mobile game publishers " we start good but there aren't any games at all in their portfolio. The team doesn't have ANY game developer, just CEO, COO, Investors, Director..

https://preview.redd.it/enbnsweqakl51.png?width=1228&format=png&auto=webp&s=a5ca8337a78a6eda96f0d6b5b8351cb2e46fb0ef
Site says they are mobile games developer, so lets see Google Play store ( https://play.google.com/store/apps/developer?id=nCore+Games&hl=en )
Their profile shows only one game (1.9 rated) which is Unity made Asteroids game clone. I won't say I am surprised.

https://preview.redd.it/uva2xqsqakl51.png?width=1179&format=png&auto=webp&s=4048ae83f94d7f9b44f6db7059a9b8ec3345e6fd

https://preview.redd.it/s406dj8rakl51.png?width=1663&format=png&auto=webp&s=411dc08ebf45c70f601f864234c7c8e10be01f4a
I have been told that this game falls under "Make in India" umbrella. Maybe Vishal Gondal was able to create such crew out of people working in Indian AAA/AA game development studios? I used well known list on Wikipedia to find how many studios are there ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_game_developers ).

https://preview.redd.it/om8ivr3sakl51.png?width=1669&format=png&auto=webp&s=9ddef11901043cba80bc066e7880c84a06c84788
EDIT: Thank to your feedback about India AAA Studios, I updated list.
India AAA Studios:
  • Rockstar India (former Dhruva Interactive, Bangalore)
  • Ubisoft (Pune, Mumbai)
  • Electronic Arts (Hyderabad)
I googled a little to get other lists and found this - https://www.goodfirms.co/game-development-companies/india. Rest of companies are quite small, not able to create such big project and not experienced enough.
How this game will be made in India and when, if there are only three AAA gamedev companies in India who can make a game that they showed in game trailer? Or they will outsource the game project to any foreign AAA studio under name of Indian nCore company and call it an "Indian Game".
Now let me tell you what it takes to make game similar to what they showed in FAU-G teaser.
It is very complex proces that needs time, iteration and good design. Making a AA or AAA game takes years to make. For example Call of Duty game serie has 3 year development cycle. The newest production is made by two huge studios - Raven Software and Treyarch. Treyarch only has 600 people. ( https://www.gfinityesports.com/article/2874/call-of-duty-black-ops-cold-war-leaks-release-date-beta-gameplay-trailer-teasers-warzone-multiplayer-zombies-campaign-and-everything-you-need-to-know )
For PUBG, data say it was process of 1-2 years of development. To release FAU-G 'soon' game would need to be in production for about a year already with a team of not 6 directors but at least 50 developers.
All of this made me think that this game won't be released ever or this won't be a PUBG clone but some simple shooter game, that will be released and forgotten very fast.
--
EDIT: When I started to research about FAU-G there was only one "supposed" nCore games channel on YouTube. The moment I published my post here, I noticed there are hundreds of bots nCore accounts created on YT within an hour. I'm surprised, why ?
EDIT2: Typos, Updated with feedback.
EDIT: Thank you very much for the awards kind strangers. I really appreciate it. Also thank you for the discussion under the thread and your feedback.
submitted by Torn-TheArchitect to IndianGaming [link] [comments]


2020.09.06 18:47 Torn-TheArchitect Why FAU-G is a HOAX? From the perspective of European AAA game developer.

Why FAU-G is a HOAX? From the perspective of European AAA game developer.
I know there is a huge discussion around this "Project". Also controversy that PUB-G was banned, and now this thing is being produced. I needed to share my thoughts about this as a AAA game developer.
When a serious game company decides to reveal information about their project they show a teaser that will 'sell' the mood of the game, setting, gameplay, etc. depending of how advanced the production is. Even when is not much to show, they have game design document, rough prototypes of mechanics. One is sure, no real gamedev company uses bought stock content to promote their game.
And here we begin - a Twitter post ( https://twitter.com/vishalgondal/status/1301822102471811074?s=19 ).

https://preview.redd.it/j657rlui3kl51.png?width=585&format=png&auto=webp&s=81da297d76aa27e3f9a4a8b22b43069726a3b61b
There is absolutely no information about the game. There is one word "Action Game" which can define games from Pac Man to Mortal Combat. Also from other twitter posts we can learn that game will teach about "sacrifices of our soldiers". I guess it's about sacrifices of Indian soldiers - so... it is perfectly normal to make a teaser poster of game with stock photo of American Soldiers ( www.shutterstock.com/image-photo/battle-military-war-troops-smoke-1045196350 ). There is also a word "soon" - we will get to that later.
EDIT: Why this poster thing is important to me? Let me give you an example.
Last year ISRO has launched succesfully Chandrayaan2. Can you imagine that the first information about this project would be a post on Twitter with a photograph of american rocket with poorly Photoshoped India flag? It will be a shitstorm. So why it is okay to do the same for a game? Let's be serious and threat target audience seriously.
So how we know it will be a PUBG clone?

https://preview.redd.it/ex9v54yx3kl51.png?width=583&format=png&auto=webp&s=7f6e9d1fd8fe916315593ab5e62aeeb58fdd95ff
And that's all info relating to PUBG. But lets assume FAUG will be actually a PUBG clone.
EDIT: It turned out The trailer is probably fake material posted on ncore games YouTube channel. Probably it's not official site. I will still put it in spoiler tag if anyone wants to see it anyway.
After the teaser poster comes TRAILER uploaded at nCORE Games youtube channel ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXv2jazfXT0 )

https://preview.redd.it/d12aldry3kl51.png?width=1203&format=png&auto=webp&s=9921a7423c4988b26ee22751b099aa526a7904e0
And what happened? From modern time USA we jumped to Second World War, in Europe. There is European architecture from those times, guns, vehicles, etc. And people are talking in Polish there ( I was surprised to hear my mother language in Indian game trailer, and this made me intrigued. And here I am, disappointed ). BTW HALT means STOP in German.
Conclusions for now - nCORE Games, has absolutely no content and no idea how the game should and will look like. They use stock materials to promote non existing project.
Let's move on and assume they actually know what game they are making. So we will see the Company Portfolio, just to see if they can deliver. " nCore Games - Leading mobile game publishers " we start good but there aren't any games at all in their portfolio. The team doesn't have ANY game developer, just CEO, COO, Investors, Director..

https://preview.redd.it/2wf8og8z3kl51.png?width=1228&format=png&auto=webp&s=bb90ad76ef60b2da4bc1e2118d743874840a9db2
Site says they are mobile games developer, so lets see Google Play store ( https://play.google.com/store/apps/developer?id=nCore+Games&hl=en )
Their profile shows only one game (1.9 rated) which is Unity made Asteroids game clone. I won't say I am surprised.

https://preview.redd.it/ju7dfuw14kl51.png?width=1179&format=png&auto=webp&s=e44e3dedce60877df2cd64dc55186f3ef479f680

https://preview.redd.it/80rkeje24kl51.png?width=1663&format=png&auto=webp&s=7a1c68237d1fa133248e7d65ac8c8f2508a07266
I have been told that this game falls under "Make in India" umbrella. Maybe Vishal Gondal was able to create such crew out of people working in Indian AAA/AA game development studios? I used well known list on Wikipedia to find how many studios are there ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_game_developers ).

https://preview.redd.it/olnsqs734kl51.png?width=1669&format=png&auto=webp&s=a10f9ab2286ff8999d93e52c60dc05ee2ad4be3a
EDIT: Thank to your feedback about India AAA Studios, I updated list.
India AAA Studios:
  • Rockstar India (former Dhruva Interactive, Bangalore)
  • Ubisoft (Pune, Mumbai)
  • Electronic Arts (Hyderabad)
I googled a little to get other lists and found this - https://www.goodfirms.co/game-development-companies/india. Rest of companies are quite small, not able to create such big project and not experienced enough.
How this game will be made in India and when, if there are only three AAA gamedev companies in India who can make a game that they showed in game trailer? Or they will outsource the game project to any foreign AAA studio under name of Indian nCore company and call it an "Indian Game".
Now let me tell you what it takes to make game similar to what they showed in FUBg teaser.
It is very complex proces that needs time, iteration and good design. Making a AA or AAA game takes years to make. For example Call of Duty game serie has 3 year development cycle. The newest production is made by two huge studios - Raven Software and Treyarch. Treyarch only has 600 people. ( https://www.gfinityesports.com/article/2874/call-of-duty-black-ops-cold-war-leaks-release-date-beta-gameplay-trailer-teasers-warzone-multiplayer-zombies-campaign-and-everything-you-need-to-know )
For PUBG, data say it was process of 1-2 years of development. To release FAUG 'soon' game would need to be in production for about a year already with a team of not 6 directors but at least 50 developers.
All of this made me think that this game won't be released ever or this won't be a PUBG clone but some simple shooter game, that will be released and forgotten very fast.
---
EDIT: When I started to research about FUB-G there was only one "supposed" nCore games channel on YouTube. The moment I published my post here, I noticed there are hundreds of bots nCore accounts created on YT within an hour. I'm surprised, why ?
EDIT2: Typos, Updated with feedback.
EDIT: Thank you for the discussion under the thread and your feedback.
submitted by Torn-TheArchitect to IndiaSpeaks [link] [comments]


2020.09.06 18:43 Torn-TheArchitect Why FAU-G is a HOAX? From the perspective of European AAA game developer.

Why FAU-G is a HOAX? From the perspective of European AAA game developer.
I know there is a huge discussion around this "Project". Also controversy that PUBG was banned, and now this thing is being produced. I needed to share my thoughts about this as a AAA game developer.
When a serious game company decides to reveal information about their project they show a teaser that will 'sell' the mood of the game, setting, gameplay, etc. depending of how advanced the production is. Even when is not much to show, they have game design document, rough prototypes of mechanics. One is sure, no real gamedev company uses bought stock content to promote their game.
And here we begin - a Twitter post ( https://twitter.com/vishalgondal/status/1301822102471811074?s=19 ).

Twitter Post
There is absolutely no information about the game. There is one word "Action Game" which can define games from Pac Man to Mortal Kombat. Also from other twitter posts we can learn that game will teach about "sacrifices of our soldiers". I guess it's about sacrifices of Indian soldiers - so... it is perfectly normal to make a teaser poster of game with stock photo of American Soldiers ( www.shutterstock.com/image-photo/battle-military-war-troops-smoke-1045196350 ). There is also a word soon - we will get to that later.
So how we know it will be a PUBG clone?
https://preview.redd.it/el7z20kjljl51.png?width=583&format=png&auto=webp&s=6c4d9b3cfde0d7df67e689eefacbf63d172a8546
And that's all info relating to PUBG. But lets assume FAU-G will be actually a PUBG clone.
EDIT: It turned out The trailer is probably fake material posted on ncore games YouTube channel. Probably it's not official site. I will still put it in spoiler tag if anyone wants to see it anyway.
After the teaser poster comes TRAILER uploaded at nCORE Games youtube channel ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXv2jazfXT0 )
Trailer Screenshot
And what happened? From modern time USA we jumped to Second World War, in Europe. There is European architecture from those times, guns, vehicles, etc. And people are talking in Polish there ( I was surprised to hear my mother language in Indian game trailer, and this made me intrigued. And here I am, disappointed ). BTW HALT means STOP in German.
Conclusions for now - nCORE Games, has absolutely no content and no idea how the game should and will look like. They use stock materials to promote non existing project.
Let's move on and assume they actually know what game they are making. So we will see the Company Portfolio, just to see if they can deliver. " nCore Games - Leading mobile game publishers " we start good but there aren't any games at all in their portfolio. The team doesn't have ANY game developer, just CEO, COO, Investors, Director..
https://preview.redd.it/lwa7fj9wsjl51.png?width=1228&format=png&auto=webp&s=721b8b523cb72953b53571c61219e773d50a4f16
Site says they are mobile games developer, so lets see Google Play store ( https://play.google.com/store/apps/developer?id=nCore+Games&hl=en )
nCore Games profile on Google Play
noname shooter by nCore Games
Their profile shows only one game (1.9 rated) which is Unity made Asteroids game clone. I won't say I am surprised.
I have been told that this game falls under "Make in India" umbrella. Maybe Vishal Gondal was able to create such crew out of people working in Indian AAA/AA game development studios? I used well known list on Wikipedia to find how many studios are there ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_game_developers ).
https://preview.redd.it/67svqc9ovjl51.png?width=1669&format=png&auto=webp&s=e58799f447b51603b1be711e767959e9c8417b84
EDIT: Thank to your feedback about India AAA Studios, I updated list.
India AAA Studios:
  • Rockstar India (former Dhruva Interactive, Bangalore)
  • Ubisoft (Pune, Mumbai)
  • Electronic Arts (Hyderabad)
I googled a little to get other lists and found this - https://www.goodfirms.co/game-development-companies/india. Rest of companies are quite small, not able to create such big project and not experienced enough.
How this game will be made in India and when, if there are only three AAA gamedev companies in India who can make a game that they showed in game trailer? Or they will outsource the game project to any foreign AAA studio under name of Indian nCore company and call it an "Indian Game".
Now let me tell you what it takes to make game similar to what they showed in FAU-g teaser.
It is very complex proces that needs time, iteration and good design. Making a AA or AAA game takes years to make. For example Call of Duty game serie has 3 year development cycle. The newest production is made by two huge studios - Raven Software and Treyarch. Treyarch only has 600 people. ( https://www.gfinityesports.com/article/2874/call-of-duty-black-ops-cold-war-leaks-release-date-beta-gameplay-trailer-teasers-warzone-multiplayer-zombies-campaign-and-everything-you-need-to-know )
For PUBG, data say it was process of 1-2 years of development. To release FAU-G 'soon' game would need to be in production for about a year already with a team of not 6 directors but at least 50 developers.
All of this made me think that this game won't be released ever or this won't be a PUBG clone but some simple shooter game, that will be released and forgotten very fast.
--

EDIT: When I started to research about FAU-G there was only one "supposed" nCore games channel on YouTube. The moment I published my post here, I noticed there are hundreds of bots nCore accounts created on YT within an hour. I'm surprised, why ?
EDIT2: Typos, Updated with feedback.
EDIT: Thank you very much for the awards kind strangers. I really appreciate it. Also thank you for the discussion under the thread and your feedback.
submitted by Torn-TheArchitect to india [link] [comments]


2020.09.05 03:29 StevenStevens43 The British Olduwan

The British Olduwan
Olduvai gorge:
One of the most important archaeological and anthropological sites in the world, in understanding the earliest known origins of Human-being, comes from a location known as Olduvai gorge in Tanzania, were Oldowan is thought to have first began evolving in to modern human, 1.9 million years ago.
Olduvai gorge
The Olduvai Gorge it has proven invaluable in furthering understanding of early human evolution.

Homo habilis, approximately 1.9 million years ago
Link for photo
However, it is likely that Olduwan was born from inter-racial breeding
Oldowan:
It appears one of the first things Oldowan man done, was go seeking for lands, perhaps a little cooler in temperature, as Olduwan, 1.8 million years ago first appeared in Georgia, Europe.
In fact, by 1 million years ago, Olduwan man had even turned up in the area that would be considered modern day London.
Pre-history of Europe
Homo erectus georgicus, which lived roughly 1.8 million years ago in Georgia), is the earliest hominid to have been discovered in Europe.
Link for photo
Olduwan expansion
Indonesia:
Other Oldowans headed for Indonesia.
Paleolithic
Homo erectus in Indonesia by 1.8 million years
Link for photo_without_national_boundaries.svg)
Russia:
1.5 million years ago, Oldowan man entered Russia, by the Caucasus, which leads in to Scandanavia from the Northern land bridge, which still exists today.
Pre-history
In 2006, 1.5-million-year-old Oldowan flint tools were discovered in the Dagestan Akusha region of the north Caucasus,
Link for photo.svg)
Dagestan
China:
China 1.35m years ago
Paleolithic)
Recent study shows that the stone tools found at Xiaochangliang site are magnetostratigraphically dated to 1.36 million years ago.[9]
Link for photo
Return of Oldowan:
It would appear one of Olduwans descendants, likely returned to Africa around, 300,000 BC, via europe. Crossing the Gibraltar straits.
Paleolithic
the Acheulean. Possibly the first hunters, H. erectus mastered the art of making fire and was the first hominid to leave Africa, colonizing most of Afro-Eurasia and perhaps later giving rise to Homo floresiensis.

The earliest known Homo sapiens fossils include the Jebel Irhoud remains from Morocco (ca. 315,000 years ago),[12]

Don't take offence:
Ok, now, it is likely that the first modern humans, are still around today, in the exact same form they were then. And today, they are classed as "intelligent modern humans".
They were likely, "the pygmy peoples".
The reason they were likely the same people, as todays pygmy peoples, comes from the knowledge that the Jebel Irhoud, were extremely small in size.
Morphology
The Jebel Irhoud individuals also had very thick brow ridges and lacked prognathism.[18]
Link for photo
Magdalenian:
Now, anthropoligical studies pretty much prove, that the Magdalenians that inhabited mainland europe between 17,000 BC and the onset of the younger dryas, were the same people as Jebel Irhoud.
Period biology
The fauna of the Magdalenian epoch seems to have included tigers .
Magdalenian humans appear to have been of short stature, dolichocephalic, with a low retreating forehead and prominent brow ridges.
Link for photo
Magdalenian expansion
Cheddar man:
The map above does not attribute Southern parts of Britain, to have been colonialised by the Magdalenians, however Britains oldest known skeleton is Cheddar man, believed to be from around 9,100 BC, and also thought by anthropologists, to be black in skin colour.
Cheddar man
Cheddar Man is a human male fossil found in Gough's Cave in Cheddar Gorge, Somerset, England. The skeletal remains date to the Mesolithic (ca. 9100 BP, 7100 BC) and dark or dark to black skin.[2]
Link for photo
Doggerland:
The reason it would have been so easy for the Magdalene to colonise Thames valley, would be due to the fact that, not only would they have the brain capacity to cross the Gibraltar straits, they would also have the advantage of being able to cross the Doggerland land bridge, which had not sunk yet, until 6,500 BC.
Doggerland
Doggerland was an area of land, now submerged beneath the southern North Sea, that connected Britain to continental Europe. It was flooded by rising sea levels around 6500–6200 BC.
Link for photo
Doggerland
Pygmy peoples:
Pygmy peoples of today, can be found mostly in the Congo region of Africa.
They are a peoples which typically average a height of less than 4 ft 11.
Pygmy peoples
In anthropology, pygmy peoples are ethnic groups whose average height is unusually short. The term pygmyism is used to describe the phenotype of endemic short stature (as opposed to disproportionate dwarfism occurring in isolated cases in a population) for populations in which adult men are on average less than 150 cm (4 ft 11 in) tall.[1]
The term is primarily associated with the African Pygmies, the hunter-gatherers of the Congo basin (comprising the Bambenga, Bambuti and Batwa).[2]
Link for photo
Pygmy peoples
Effacer le Tableau:
Whilst the only noticable difference between you, and a Pygmy person, is their small stature, and the fact that even today, they are hunter gatherers, despite some politically correct Scientists insisting that Pygmy peoples are not descended from Hunter gatherers, the Pygmy peoples have been the victims of repeated attempted genocides and extermination campaigns.
Most recently, January 2003.
Violence against pygmy peoples
From the end of 2002 through January 2003 around 60,000 pygmy civilians and 10,000 combatants were killed in an extermination campaign known as "Effacer le Tableau" during the Second Congo War.[27][28] Human rights activists have made demands for the massacre to be recognized as genocide.[29]
Link for photo
Baka dancers
Bantu master:
Even "today" the Bantu make no bones about the fact that they are the pygmy peoples "masters".
Perhaps it makes them feel big.
However even "you" have joined in, on Pygmy genocidal bullying, without even knowing it, or have you never used the term "mongo", in your younger years?
Mongo, is a pygmy language, aswell as a Pygmy location.
The word Mongo, should not be used disparagingly.
But unless you want to be part of a genocide campaign, you should also not ban the word from your vocabulary.
Simply use it, respectfully.
To put in to simple terms.
If a pygmy person went on the internet, and told everyone he was a Mongo, he would likely be banned, by a well meaning leftist, that does not realise that, this this person, really is from a village called Mongo, near congo, and speaks Mongo, and banning this person is about the most insulting and racial discriminative thing one could possibly do.
Reported slavery
In the Republic of the Congo, where Pygmies make up 2% of the population, many Pygmies live as slaves to Bantu masters. The nation is deeply stratified between these two major ethnic groups. The pygmy slaves belong to their Bantu masters from birth in a relationship that the Bantus call a time-honored tradition. Even though the Pygmies are responsible for much of the hunting, fishing and manual labor in jungle villages, Pygmies and Bantus alike say that Pygmies are often paid at the master's whim: in cigarettes, used clothing, or simply not paid at all.
Link for photo.png)
Pygmy language centres
Zoos:
Discimination against pygmy peoples is not new.
Pygmy peoples, even recently, have been sent to live in zoo cages next to Lions and Tigers, and many people view Pygmy peoples, as Paleolithics.
Even in the USA, as early as 1907, they were viewed as a circus act, alongside animals.
Systematic discrimination
Historically, the pygmy have always been viewed as inferior by both colonial authorities and the village-dwelling Bantu tribes.[15] Pygmy children were sometimes captured during the period of the Congo Free State, which exported pygmy children to zoos throughout Europe, including the world's fair in the United States in 1907.[15]
Link for photo
Pygmy person in Bronx zoo cage 1906
Pepi II:
Even as far back as 2297 BC, a 13 year old Egyptian pharoah named Pepi II, took great delight in capturing a pygmy person, and bragged about to everyone in Egypt.
The Egytians begged him not to kill the pygmy person, but instead bring the Pygmy person back to Egypt.
Likely to be used for entertainment purposes.
Early years of Pepi II's reign
Sent to trade and collect ivory, ebony, and other precious items, he captured a pygmy. News of this reached the royal court, and an excited young king sent word back to Harkhuf that he would be greatly rewarded if the pygmy were brought back alive, where he would have likely served as an entertainer for the court.
Link for photo
Iymeru:
But what do we learn from this?
We learn that modern humans from 300,000 BC had the potential to be extremely literate, intelligent, and that the idea that even Olduwan may have been an Ape, is simply misguided ancient discrimination and racism, and was genocided, quite simply because he was too stubborn to give up his traditions, and likely lacked physical build in order to stick up for himself against bigots that likely wrongfully viewed him as an illiterate fool.
However Pygmy peoples are regarded by Scientists, as modern humans.
And pygmy peoples, such as Iymeru, have been in even the highest positions of the ancient Egyptian empire.
Iymeru, was the second most powerful man in Egypt, during the 13th dynasty.
He was the Pharoahs vizier.
So much for Pepi II's circus act.
Iymeru)
Iymeru was an ancient Egyptian vizier) in office during the 13th Dynasty.
Link for photo#/media/File:Statue_Iymeru_Turin.JPG)
Iymeru
Indian pygmies:
However, there is a twist in the tale.
It appears more likley, that the magdalenian Pygmies, "were not" in fact the same pygmy peoples as todays Congo contingent, but in actual fact, were more likely Indian pygmies.
The African pygmies likely took the long way round the world, instead of going directly across the Gibraltar straits.
South east Asia
Frank Kingdon-Ward in the early 20th century reported a tribe of pygmy Tibeto-Burman speakers known as the Taron inhabiting the remote region of Mt. Hkakabo Razi in Southeast Asia on the border of China (Yunnan and Tibet), Burma, and India.
Link for photo
Indian Pygmy
Indo-European
The reason it was more likley Indian pygmies, than African pygmies, comes from the fact that there is plenty more evidence, which i will reveal later, of Indian descended people, having colonised Europe, and even America.
Not only this, one of the most common languages in todays world, is Indo-European.
Indo-European likley was a language that evolved over thousands of years, likely in stages, and likley due to pro-longed exposure to one anothers culture.
Indo-Aryan first arose in the Levant around the time of the ancient egyptian empire, when Indians and Aryans colonized lower egypt.
Indo-European evolved when Indo-Aryans invaded India during the battle of the ten kings in 1400 BC.
Though, it was likley that the Aryan language, already contained certain Indo components, by the time the colonized Egypt, and those were probably picked up from the Magdalenian period, when Aryans likely had to invade european mainland to escape the polar ice-caps, and integrated with Megdalenians.
Though, Indian genes in the northern hemisphere even pre-dated the Magdalenians, which i will cover later, so it is also likely, that when the Aryans invaded european mainland, and integrated with Magdalenians, their Aryan language already contained Indo components.
We can also see by the photo of the Philippino girl, how Anthropologists could mistake Cheddar man for being black.
This is due to the fact, that Indians, "are" descended from Africans, so, in a round about way, the Magdalenian "are" African pygmies, though not as directly as one would first think.
It is likley that the Magdalenian arrived in europe via India.
Though they likely made their escape, over the Gibraltar straits, the place were it all began.
Saudi Arabia:
Whilst it is actually likely, that modern day human was already living in Scandanavia, and even european mainland, as far back as 300,000 years ago, it is most probably that any evidence of this, was washed away during the younger dryas, when both Britain and Scandanavia, lay under polar ice-caps.
But the first "recorded" movement of modern day humans, comes from 75,000 years ago when Africans first entered the Arabian peninsula.
Pre-history
A 2011 study found that the first modern humans to spread east across Asia left Africa about 75,000 years ago across the Bab-el-Mandeb connecting the Horn of Africa and Arabia.[56]
Link for photo
Arabian expansion
India:
Modern human, from the Arabian peninsula, arrived in India, sometime between 80,000 and 60,000 years ago.
Paleolithic
"Modern human beings—Homo sapiens—originated in Africa. Then, intermittently, sometime between 60,000 and 80,000 years ago, tiny groups of them began to enter the north-west of the Indian subcontinent.
Link for photo
Israel:
As Israel was in Mesopotamia, Africans travelling to the Arabian peninsula, Indonesia, or anywhere else, would have no other option than to go through the Levant, making Israel one of the earliest populated areas by modern human.
120,000 years ago.
And almost definitely Black African.
Pre-history
The oldest fossils of anatomically modern humans found outside Africa are the Skhul and Qafzeh hominins, who lived in the area that is now northern Israel 120,000 years ago.[85]
Link for photo
Neanderthal man:
The best evidence of what Neanderthal man looked like, comes from very well preserved remains of Neanderthals found in Shanidar cave in Iraq.
The remains were thought to be from between 60,000 and 80,000 years ago, and they do point to a slightly different culture sharing the lands of Mesopotamia, with Africans.
Iraq pre-history
During 1957–1961 Shanidar Cave was excavated by Ralph Solecki and his team from Columbia University, and nine skeletons of Neanderthal man of varying ages and states of preservation and completeness (labelled Shanidar I–IX) were discovered dating from 60,000–80,000 years BP.
Link for photo
Neanderthal man
Neanderthal:
Neanderthals got a bad rap.
There is no doubt Neanderthal was Asiatic.
And do you remember Pepi II? That wonderful African pharoah that delightfully hunted down a "pygmy" when he was a boy? Well, this African also took great delight in carrying on the honoured age old African tradition of "smiting" Asiatics.
Well racism and discrimination is actually quite prevalent within the ancient egyptian dynasties, and an ancient old traditional practise of native egyptians smiting inferior Asiatics, can be traced back to 3000 BC, during the reign of Den.
The depiction even included a "bearded" foe.
Events#Events)
The picture shows Den in a gesture known as "smiting the enemy". In one hand Den holds a mace, in the other hand he grabs a foe by his hair. Thanks to the braids and the conic beard the foe has been identified as of Asian origin. The hieroglyphs at the right side say "first smiting of the east".
Link for photo
Smiting asiatics
Literate:
Now, i am hoping i no longer have to go in to too much detail about how, in actual fact, Scientists now think Neanderthal man was likely literate, and actually extremely intelligent.
In fact, intelligent Africans "would not" interbreed with an idiot.
And Neanderthal man did breed with other humans in this area.
In fact, breeding with Neanderthal man, is likely where Africans gained a bit more bulk from, by breeding with a person that is derived from Northern sub grouos, that have grown to be a bit bulkier in bulk, in order to with stand the cold winters.
He also likely was 50/50 in providing the components that would later evolve in to the AfrAsian language, that is spoken by Semites, and Arabians, as well as some Africans, but nobody knows were it evolved from.
Neanderthal
Neanderthal technology is thought to have been quite sophisticated.
Compared to modern humans, Neanderthals had a more robust) build and proportionally shorter limbs. These features are often explained as adaptations to conserve heat in a cold climate,
Neanderthal got cornered in Spain:
Now just like the previous two groups, Neanderthal, being from european mainland, and who still exists today, got cornered in Spain, by this new anatomically modern human-being.
Inter-group relations
Canadian ethnoarchaeologist Brian Hayden calculated a self-sustaining population which avoids inbreeding to consist of about 450–500 individuals, which would necessitate these bands to interact with 8–53 other bands, but more likely the more conservative estimate given low population density.[31] Analysis of the mtDNA of the Neanderthals of Cueva del Sidrón, Spain, showed that the adult three men belonged to the same maternal lineage, while the three adult women belonged to different ones. This suggests a patrilocal residence (that a woman moved out of her group to live with her husband).[233] However, the DNA of a Neanderthal from Denisova Cave, Russia, shows that she had an inbreeding coefficient of ​1⁄8 (her parents were either half-siblings with a common mother, double first cousins, an uncle and niece or aunt and nephew, or a grandfather and granddaughter or grandmother and grandson)[83] and the inhabitants of Cueva del Sidrón show several defects, which may have been caused by inbreeding or recessive disorders.[218]
Link for photo
Neanderthal
Anatomically modern people:
Now, do you remember the Magdalenians from earlier in this post?
Well here is a photo of Anatomically modern people.
Early modern human
Early modern human (EMH) or anatomically modern human (AMH)[2] are terms used to distinguish Homo sapiens (the only extant human species) that are anatomically consistent with the range of phenotypes seen in contemporary humans from extinct archaic human species. This distinction is useful especially for times and regions where anatomically modern and archaic humans co-existed, for example, in Paleolithic Europe.
Link for photo
Early modern human
Neanderthal did not get wiped out:
The early modern human however, did not wipe Neanderthal out.
They shared european mainland with other literate human-beings.
Some of those human-beings, particularly the ones from Britain, that at this point in time, is just a part of Eurasia, probably looked more like this.

Western neanderthal
Denisovan:
Now, Neanderthal not only spread out from Mesopotamia along European lines, and escaped via Spain, but also along Northern lines, before escaping in to Canada via the Bering land bridge, that was around at the time.
However, the remains are no longer considered to be that of Neadnerthal, but in fact, that of Denisovan, the ancestor of Australian aboriginals, as well as Inuits and Paleo-Indians in America, and others.
Pre-history
That Russia was also home to some of the last surviving Neanderthals was revealed by the discovery of the partial skeleton of a Neanderthal infant in Mezmaiskaya cave in Adygea, which was carbon dated to only 29,000 years ago.[6] In 2008, Russian archaeologists from the Institute of Archaeology and Ethnology of Novosibirsk, working at the site of Denisova Cave in the Altai Mountains of Siberia, uncovered a 40,000-year-old small bone fragment from the fifth finger of a juvenile hominin, which DNA analysis revealed to be a previously unknown species of human, which was named the Denisova hominin.[7]
Link for photo.jpg)
Denisovan
Lapland:
Now, it is likely that Paleo-Indians lived in europe, relatively peacefully, with one another.
At least until the younger dryas, when blond haired blue eyed Aryans from Scandinavia had to invade European mainland.
It is likely what happened during this period, is Aryans became less friendly, and forced Anatomically modern humans to flee via Spain, go and live in the Northern regions and peripheries as Eskimos in Iglus, or go and breed with the current Indigenous peoples of America and Australia and update their DNA.
When the Ice-caps melted, Scandinavians likely returned to Scandinavia, and pushed the Sami people farther and farther north, until they could go no farther north, and to this day, there is a peoples in the most Northern regions of Scandanavia and Russia that regard themselves as the indigenous peoples of Scandinavia and Russia.
They are called the Sami peoples.
You have likley heard of them, without realising it.
They are Laplanders.
The place Santa Klaus is from.
Sami people
The Sámi people (/ˈsɑːmi/; also spelled Sami or Saami) are an indigenous Finno-Ugric people inhabiting Sápmi, which today encompasses large northern parts of Norway, Sweden, Finland and the Kola Peninsula within the Murmansk Oblast of Russia. The Sámi have historically been known in English as Lapps or Laplanders. Sámi ancestral lands are not well-defined. Their traditional languages are the Sámi languages which are classified as a branch of the Uralic language family.
Link for photo
Sami peoples
Indigenous Americans:
The Indigenous colonisation of the Americas happened in two waves.
The first was between 57,000 BC and 17,000 BC.
However a Polar Ice wall prevented the first arrivals from prevailing any farther than Alaska.
Migrations in to the continents
Alaska was a glacial refugium because it had low snowfall, allowing a small population to exist. The Laurentide Ice Sheet covered most of North America, blocking nomadic inhabitants and confining them to Alaska (East Beringia) for thousands of years.[53]
Second wave:
Just as the Polar ice wall in Alaska was beginning to melt, and the ice-caps began shifting towards Britain and Scandinavia, the Aryans likely came down from the Northern lands, and many Paleo-Indians likely fleed across the melting Bering land bridge and got over just in time, to breed with Indigenous Alaskans, and populate the Americas.
Canada pre-history
The first inhabitants of North America are generally hypothesized to have migrated from Siberia by way of the Bering land bridge and arrived at least 14,000 years ago.[23]
South America:
Obviously some Paleo-Indians made it over the Ice-wall prior to the second wave arriving, as archaeologists are of the belief that South America saw it's first arrivals around 16,500 BC.
Pre-columbian era
The earliest archaeological evidence from human settlement in South America comes from Monte Verde (possibly as early as 16,500 BCE).[11]
Isolation:
Until the arrival of the Spanish during the Columbian era, Paleo-Indians would have been pretty isolated, with not too much opportunity for evolving, so the 1500 AD perfectly intact mummified Inca sacrifice, would give a good clue as to what the Paleo-Indians that arrived 14,000 years ago, or even 57,000 years ago, looked like.
Link for photo
Inca sacrifice
The Australian aboriginals have a similar ancestry.
The fact that modern Australian aboriginals have the exact same ancestors as US Indigenous peoples, and were hunter gatherers when Aryans first arrived in Australia, despite making crossings on land bridges on two seperate sides of the globe, is pretty much suggestive that early modern anatomical Indonesians inhabited most of the globe, and were very much literate. And modern, and they in turn were likely descended from a mixture of Israeli Neanderthal and Afro pygmy persons.
Pre-history
Human habitation of the Australian continent is known to have begun at least 65,000 years ago,[45][46] with the migration of people by land bridges and short sea-crossings from what is now Southeast Asia.[47] The Madjedbebe rock shelter in Arnhem Land is recognised as the oldest site showing the presence of humans in Australia.[48] The oldest human remains found are the Lake Mungo remains, which have been dated to around 41,000 years ago.[49]
At the time of first European contact, most Indigenous Australians were hunter-gatherers with complex economies and societies.[53
Greenland:
The Paleo-Indonesians even found their way to Greenland by 2500 BC.
Early Paleo eskimo cultures
In prehistoric times, Greenland was home to several successive Paleo-Eskimo cultures known today primarily through archaeological finds. The earliest entry of the Paleo-Eskimo into Greenland is thought to have occurred about 2500 BC.
And the photo just goes to show, the farther North you get, the whiter you get, as ones skin evolves to adapt to the cold.
And when you get even farther north, the redder you get.
Link to photo.jpg)
Greenlandic Inuit couple
Summary:
But, the point is, that blond haired blue eyed Aryans almost definitely pre-dated the younger dryas, and they moved southward, and any trace of their previous existence was wiped out by one of humanities greatest ever Cataclysms when an entire sub-contentent, and an Island, was cut in half from manland europe.
All this happened between only 6500 and 11,000 BC.
The northward movements that have been attributed to the populating of Britain and Scandinavia, and the sudden appearance of white blue eyed people, was actually a "re-population", and they already lived in those lands previous to that.
They had lived and evolved in those lands, ever since Oldowan turned up in the Thames valley 1 million BC, and 1.5 million BC in Russia.
But until the younger dryas came and wiped any history of them out, they had no real reason to make any significant appearance on european mainland, were archaeological evidence would be preserved.
And that is why the first archaeological evidence of white man only appears after and during the Younger dryas.
However britain was likely not originally inhabited by pure Aryans.
Pure Aryans likely began colonising Britain only after the Northward migrations.
And even then. they likley shared the Island with Greekish looking people, as well as possibly even remnants of Indonesians, and the place likely got divided after Doggerland sank, and Scandinavians eventually began adding Britain to their North sea expansion.
Likely beginning around 3000 BC, with the invention of their Hjortspring boat.
Bronze age
Thousands of rock carvings from this period depict ships, and the large stone burial monuments known as stone ships, suggest that ships and seafaring played an important role in the culture at large. The depicted ships most likely represent sewn plank built canoes used for warfare, fishing and trade. These ship types may have their origin as far back as the neolithic period and they continue into the Pre-Roman Iron Age, as exemplified by the Hjortspring boat.[43]
submitted by StevenStevens43 to AhrensburgCulture [link] [comments]


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submitted by MansA2Sepl to u/MansA2Sepl [link] [comments]


2020.09.02 07:03 StonksArthur Walmart VS Amazon, the next big online retailer (Walmart DD). Why my money is on Walmart

Walmart Due Dilligence
PARTNERSHIPS
- Partnership with Instacart
Recently Walmart and Instacart have founded a partnership that will allow Walmart to use Instacart their same-day shipping service. [Walmart and Instacart together make up for nearly 50% of the online grocery sales.]( https://secondmeasure.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/GroceryDelivery-chart2png-1024x631.png) Walmart’s vast inventory and Instacart their network and experience will only strengthen their position as the dominant grocery delivery providers, and thus putting more pressure on Amazon.
- Partnership with Shopify
In addition to Instacart Walmart has also partnered with Shopify. This new partnership will allow third-party sellers to directly sell their item’s on the Walmart marketplace. This new partnership will greatly expand Walmart’s inventory while giving small businesses the opportunity to reach a bigger demographic. Walmart is expecting to add 1200 Shopify sellers in 2020. Listing an item on Walmart’s marketplace allows Walmart to pick up some fees and generate greater traffic to the website. Another interesting possibility to consider is the fact that Walmart could be used as a Shopify returns hub, with a Walmart being within 10 miles of 90% of the US population it is the ideal candidate for further strengthening their relation with Shopify and saving both parties a lot of money.
- Partnership with ThredUp
Walmart has also partnered with Thredup. ThredUp is basically an online thrift shop for clothes and wearable’s. This brilliant partnership means Walmart can now offer both normal and high-end clothing on their marketplace for an affordable price and expose customers to nearly 750,000 pre-owned items. Who would’ve ever thought you could tell someone that you bought your Michael Kors or Calvin Klein at Walmart.
- Google
Walmart has been partners with Google for over 3 years now. This partnership allowed Walmart to enter the domain of voice ordering groceries. Simply ask one of your Google devices to buy milk and it will add milk to your Shopping cart. This Partnership might just be the beginning of a strong bond between Google and Walmart as both companies are interested in competing with Amazon.
- Microsoft (+ Possible TikTok acquisition)
Walmart has been partnered with Microsoft for about 2 years with 3 more years to go.
Since the partnership Walmart has been using the full range of Microsoft cloud solutions in a bid to accelerate their digital transformation, innovation and efficiency.
Acquisitions
- Bonobos, ModCloth, ShoeBuy, Moosejaw, Parcel
Let’s start at the beginning, with these acquisitions Walmart stated entering the e-commerce market in 2016-2017. Sadly as is known none of these are particularly success stories with the companies being sold again, being discontinued or CEO’s leaving. However Walmart learned a lot from these companies and has used this knowledge to further try to expand in the e-commerce market.
- Jet.com
The first big step in the fight against Amazon. When amazon acquired Jet.com it was a clear signal of what its intentions were. Jet.com was one of the fastest growing U.S. e-commerce companies and Walmart acquired them in September 2016. Since then a lot has happened, Jet.com has been discontinued but the knowledge, progress and technology gained due to Jet.com is irreplaceable and has given Walmart a brilliant boost into the e-commerce with their e-commerce sales increasing 29%. Furthermore (ex)CEO of jet.com Marc Lore is now the CEO of Walmart’s e-commerce.
- Flipkart
Ever heard of the small startup company called Flipkart? Maybe you have not, you should though. Flipkart owns 35% of the Indian e-commerce market, a true giant. Walmart acquired Flipkart in 2018 and ever since then it has been expanding its influence in India and fighting against Amazon for market dominance. This year Flipkart took over Walmart’s 28 Indian stores in order to expand its wholesale growth. Another interesting thing is that Walmart might make Flipkart public within the next 3 years.
- TikTok acquisition
Some very recent news of their Partnership with Microsoft is to potentially acquire TikTok. TikTok’s enormous userbase and the current pressure in the US and India have made for an interesting situation causing the partnership to push forward in the bid to acquiring TikTok. In my opinion Walmart has a very decent chance of getting TikTok and making it work. One factor that plays a big role in this is Walmart’s presence in India due to Flipkart. Flipkart is India’s biggest online store for; phones, electronics, books, home appliances, etc. With Walmart having a presence in both countries where TikTok is (going to be) banned might mean some positive things for the future, but for now that is speculation. The acquisition of TikTok would allow Walmart to use its genius algorithm and massive userbase to further promote and integrate its Walmart marketplace.
Walmart PLUS
Word is finally out, in September Walmart will be launching its Amazon competitor called Walmart plus. It will give numerous benefits to the user such as; Unlimited free delivery(with 2700 stores having same day delivery), fuel discounts and scan&go a tool to make shopping faster, all for the price of $98 per year
2 Hour Delivery
Walmart recently launches its new delivery service, called Express Delivery. This new service will allow customers to place their order online and receive their groceries (for a 10$ fee) within 2 hours. Walmart express delivery is currently available in 800 stores with plans to expand to 2000 stores. In addition to 2 hour delivery Walmart also offers same-day delivery in almost the entire United States.
5000+ US stores.
This is Walmart’s biggest weapon. The thing Amazon lacks the most is physical stores. Walmart has over 5000 stores while Amazon has just over 600 (worldwide!). If Walmart can find a way to combine e-commerce with its enormous physical presence then it could give Amazon an absolute run for its money. Remember that 90% of Americans live within 10 miles of a Walmart.
Some other interesting facts to consider.
- 90% of US population live within 10miles of a Walmart.
- Walmart’s e-commerce sales are currently up 97%
- Walmart’s expansion in Africa, India, China.

Conclusion/TLDR
Let me first state with you that this has been my first Due Dilligence and that English is not my first language.
Walmart is currently the underdog, and not many people are expecting them to properly fight Amazon. However its recent spree of partnerships and acquisitions have been a brilliant and very clear move in the direction of e-commerce. If Walmart fully utilized its massive physical network together when their growing fresh e-commerce, I see no other outcome then for Walmart to grow, grow, grow. Covid has given Walmart customers the push they needed to fully explore Walmart their marketplace, the marketplace that is now starting to fill up with thousands of sellers and endless products. Walmart VS Amazon, here we go, my money is on Walmart.
Sources:
Instacart:
https://secondmeasure.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/GroceryDelivery-chart2png-1024x631.png
https://www.forbes.com/sites/walterloeb/2020/08/12/walmart-teams-up-with-instacart-to-rival-amazons-fast-grocery-delivery/#3bde97546010
https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/11/21363507/walmart-instacart-partnership-same-day-grocery-delivery-amazon-whole-foods-rivalry
Shopify:
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/06/15/walmart-expands-its-ecommerce-marketplace-to-more-small-businesses
https://techcrunch.com/2020/06/15/walmart-partners-with-shopify-to-expand-its-online-marketplace/
https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherwalton/2020/06/15/walmarts-new-shopify-partnership-is-another-stroke-of-digital-genius/#26a4e18e3025
ThredUp
https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherwalton/2020/06/05/walmarts-thredup-partnership-is-the-best-digital-move-walmart-has-made-in-the-last-3-years/#265d62952172
https://www.walmart.com/browse/clothing/thredup-shop-all/5438_6272369_7404214
Google:
https://techcrunch.com/2019/04/02/walmart-partners-with-google-on-voice-enabled-grocery-shopping/
https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/22/walmart-and-google-partner-on-voice-based-shopping/
Microsoft + TikTok
https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/22/walmart-and-google-partner-on-voice-based-shopping/
https://news.microsoft.com/2018/07/16/walmart-establishes-strategic-partnership-with-microsoft-to-further-accelerate-digital-innovation-in-retail/
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/08/28/tech/walmart-tiktok-bid-hnk-intl/index.html
Bonobos, ModCloth, ShoeBuy, Moosejaw, Parcel
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/markets/102315/top-4-companies-owned-walmart.asp
Jet.com
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/20/walmart-ceo-on-buying-jetcom-we-would-do-that-all-over-again.html
https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/05/20/jetcom-may-be-history-but-walmart-got-what-it-need.aspx
Flipkart
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/small-biz/startups/newsbuzz/flipkart-to-acquire-walmart-indias-wholesale-business/articleshow/77122766.cms
https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights/latest-news-headlines/flipkart-is-no-1-in-india-but-faces-formidable-foe-in-amazon-say-experts-54083920
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/07/23/walmarts-majority-owned-flipkart-launches-wholesale-business-to-help-small-businesses-in-india-source-directly-from-manufacturers-and-producers
https://www.livemint.com/companies/news/will-flipkart-ipo-set-the-ball-rolling-for-indian-unicorns-1561489450378.html
Walmart PLUS
https://www.tomsguide.com/news/walmart-plus-price-launch-date-and-everything-you-need-to-know
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/09/01/walmart-introduces-walmart
2 hour delivery
https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/30/21243557/walmart-express-delivery-two-hour-groceries-electronics#:~:text=Walmart%20is%20launching%20a%20new,during%20the%20COVID%2D19%20pandemic.
https://www.roadie.com/resources/press-releases/walmart-grocery-delivery
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/05/12/the-why-and-how-behind-walmart-express-delivery?irgwc=1&sourceid=imp_0iY1nOXZ4xyOUzQwUx0Mo3EHUkiVmiRxgxJy140&veh=aff&wmlspartner=imp_1943169&clickid=0iY1nOXZ4xyOUzQwUx0Mo3EHUkiVmiRxgxJy140&sharedid=
submitted by StonksArthur to EducatedInvesting [link] [comments]


2020.09.01 20:29 StonksArthur Walmart VS Amazon, the next big online retailer (Walmart DD). Why my money is on Walmart (WMT)

Walmart Due Dilligence
PARTNERSHIPS
- Partnership with Instacart
Recently Walmart and Instacart have founded a partnership that will allow Walmart to use Instacart their same-day shipping service. [Walmart and Instacart together make up for nearly 50% of the online grocery sales.]( https://secondmeasure.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/GroceryDelivery-chart2png-1024x631.png) Walmart’s vast inventory and Instacart their network and experience will only strengthen their position as the dominant grocery delivery providers, and thus putting more pressure on Amazon.
- Partnership with Shopify
In addition to Instacart Walmart has also partnered with Shopify. This new partnership will allow third-party sellers to directly sell their item’s on the Walmart marketplace. This new partnership will greatly expand Walmart’s inventory while giving small businesses the opportunity to reach a bigger demographic. Walmart is expecting to add 1200 Shopify sellers in 2020. Listing an item on Walmart’s marketplace allows Walmart to pick up some fees and generate greater traffic to the website. Another interesting possibility to consider is the fact that Walmart could be used as a Shopify returns hub, with a Walmart being within 10 miles of 90% of the US population it is the ideal candidate for further strengthening their relation with Shopify and saving both parties a lot of money.
- Partnership with ThredUp
Walmart has also partnered with Thredup. ThredUp is basically an online thrift shop for clothes and wearable’s. This brilliant partnership means Walmart can now offer both normal and high-end clothing on their marketplace for an affordable price and expose customers to nearly 750,000 pre-owned items. Who would’ve ever thought you could tell someone that you bought your Michael Kors or Calvin Klein at Walmart.
- Google
Walmart has been partners with Google for over 3 years now. This partnership allowed Walmart to enter the domain of voice ordering groceries. Simply ask one of your Google devices to buy milk and it will add milk to your Shopping cart. This Partnership might just be the beginning of a strong bond between Google and Walmart as both companies are interested in competing with Amazon.
- Microsoft (+ Possible TikTok acquisition)
Walmart has been partnered with Microsoft for about 2 years with 3 more years to go.
Since the partnership Walmart has been using the full range of Microsoft cloud solutions in a bid to accelerate their digital transformation, innovation and efficiency.
Acquisitions
- Bonobos, ModCloth, ShoeBuy, Moosejaw, Parcel
Let’s start at the beginning, with these acquisitions Walmart stated entering the e-commerce market in 2016-2017. Sadly as is known none of these are particularly success stories with the companies being sold again, being discontinued or CEO’s leaving. However Walmart learned a lot from these companies and has used this knowledge to further try to expand in the e-commerce market.
- Jet.com
The first big step in the fight against Amazon. When amazon acquired Jet.com it was a clear signal of what its intentions were. Jet.com was one of the fastest growing U.S. e-commerce companies and Walmart acquired them in September 2016. Since then a lot has happened, Jet.com has been discontinued but the knowledge, progress and technology gained due to Jet.com is irreplaceable and has given Walmart a brilliant boost into the e-commerce with their e-commerce sales increasing 29%. Furthermore (ex)CEO of jet.com Marc Lore is now the CEO of Walmart’s e-commerce.
- Flipkart
Ever heard of the small startup company called Flipkart? Maybe you have not, you should though. Flipkart owns 35% of the Indian e-commerce market, a true giant. Walmart acquired Flipkart in 2018 and ever since then it has been expanding its influence in India and fighting against Amazon for market dominance. This year Flipkart took over Walmart’s 28 Indian stores in order to expand its wholesale growth. Another interesting thing is that Walmart might make Flipkart public within the next 3 years.
- TikTok acquisition
Some very recent news of their Partnership with Microsoft is to potentially acquire TikTok. TikTok’s enormous userbase and the current pressure in the US and India have made for an interesting situation causing the partnership to push forward in the bid to acquiring TikTok. In my opinion Walmart has a very decent chance of getting TikTok and making it work. One factor that plays a big role in this is Walmart’s presence in India due to Flipkart. Flipkart is India’s biggest online store for; phones, electronics, books, home appliances, etc. With Walmart having a presence in both countries where TikTok is (going to be) banned might mean some positive things for the future, but for now that is speculation. The acquisition of TikTok would allow Walmart to use its genius algorithm and massive userbase to further promote and integrate its Walmart marketplace.
Walmart PLUS
Word is finally out, in September Walmart will be launching its Amazon competitor called Walmart plus. It will give numerous benefits to the user such as; Unlimited free delivery(with 2700 stores having same day delivery), fuel discounts and scan&go a tool to make shopping faster, all for the price of $98 per year
2 Hour Delivery
Walmart recently launches its new delivery service, called Express Delivery. This new service will allow customers to place their order online and receive their groceries (for a 10$ fee) within 2 hours. Walmart express delivery is currently available in 800 stores with plans to expand to 2000 stores. In addition to 2 hour delivery Walmart also offers same-day delivery in almost the entire United States.
5000+ US stores.
This is Walmart’s biggest weapon. The thing Amazon lacks the most is physical stores. Walmart has over 5000 stores while Amazon has just over 600 (worldwide!). If Walmart can find a way to combine e-commerce with its enormous physical presence then it could give Amazon an absolute run for its money. Remember that 90% of Americans live within 10 miles of a Walmart.
Some other interesting facts to consider.
- 90% of US population live within 10miles of a Walmart.
- Walmart’s e-commerce sales are currently up 97%
- Walmart’s expansion in Africa, India, China.

Conclusion/TLDR
Let me first state with you that this has been my first Due Dilligence and that English is not my first language.
Walmart is currently the underdog, and not many people are expecting them to properly fight Amazon. However its recent spree of partnerships and acquisitions have been a brilliant and very clear move in the direction of e-commerce. If Walmart fully utilized its massive physical network together when their growing fresh e-commerce, I see no other outcome then for Walmart to grow, grow, grow. Covid has given Walmart customers the push they needed to fully explore Walmart their marketplace, the marketplace that is now starting to fill up with thousands of sellers and endless products. Walmart VS Amazon, here we go, my money is on Walmart.
Sources:
Instacart:
https://secondmeasure.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/GroceryDelivery-chart2png-1024x631.png
https://www.forbes.com/sites/walterloeb/2020/08/12/walmart-teams-up-with-instacart-to-rival-amazons-fast-grocery-delivery/#3bde97546010
https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/11/21363507/walmart-instacart-partnership-same-day-grocery-delivery-amazon-whole-foods-rivalry
Shopify:
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/06/15/walmart-expands-its-ecommerce-marketplace-to-more-small-businesses
https://techcrunch.com/2020/06/15/walmart-partners-with-shopify-to-expand-its-online-marketplace/
https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherwalton/2020/06/15/walmarts-new-shopify-partnership-is-another-stroke-of-digital-genius/#26a4e18e3025
ThredUp
https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherwalton/2020/06/05/walmarts-thredup-partnership-is-the-best-digital-move-walmart-has-made-in-the-last-3-years/#265d62952172
https://www.walmart.com/browse/clothing/thredup-shop-all/5438_6272369_7404214
Google:
https://techcrunch.com/2019/04/02/walmart-partners-with-google-on-voice-enabled-grocery-shopping/
https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/22/walmart-and-google-partner-on-voice-based-shopping/
Microsoft + TikTok
https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/22/walmart-and-google-partner-on-voice-based-shopping/
https://news.microsoft.com/2018/07/16/walmart-establishes-strategic-partnership-with-microsoft-to-further-accelerate-digital-innovation-in-retail/
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/08/28/tech/walmart-tiktok-bid-hnk-intl/index.html
Bonobos, ModCloth, ShoeBuy, Moosejaw, Parcel
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/markets/102315/top-4-companies-owned-walmart.asp
Jet.com
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/20/walmart-ceo-on-buying-jetcom-we-would-do-that-all-over-again.html
https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/05/20/jetcom-may-be-history-but-walmart-got-what-it-need.aspx
Flipkart
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/small-biz/startups/newsbuzz/flipkart-to-acquire-walmart-indias-wholesale-business/articleshow/77122766.cms
https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights/latest-news-headlines/flipkart-is-no-1-in-india-but-faces-formidable-foe-in-amazon-say-experts-54083920
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/07/23/walmarts-majority-owned-flipkart-launches-wholesale-business-to-help-small-businesses-in-india-source-directly-from-manufacturers-and-producers
https://www.livemint.com/companies/news/will-flipkart-ipo-set-the-ball-rolling-for-indian-unicorns-1561489450378.html
Walmart PLUS
https://www.tomsguide.com/news/walmart-plus-price-launch-date-and-everything-you-need-to-know
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/09/01/walmart-introduces-walmart
2 hour delivery
https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/30/21243557/walmart-express-delivery-two-hour-groceries-electronics#:~:text=Walmart%20is%20launching%20a%20new,during%20the%20COVID%2D19%20pandemic.
https://www.roadie.com/resources/press-releases/walmart-grocery-delivery
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/05/12/the-why-and-how-behind-walmart-express-delivery?irgwc=1&sourceid=imp_0iY1nOXZ4xyOUzQwUx0Mo3EHUkiVmiRxgxJy140&veh=aff&wmlspartner=imp_1943169&clickid=0iY1nOXZ4xyOUzQwUx0Mo3EHUkiVmiRxgxJy140&sharedid=
submitted by StonksArthur to wallstreetbets [link] [comments]


2020.09.01 20:28 StonksArthur Walmart VS Amazon, the next big online retailer (Walmart DD). Why my money is on Walmart (WMT)

Walmart Due Dilligence
PARTNERSHIPS
- Partnership with Instacart
Recently Walmart and Instacart have founded a partnership that will allow Walmart to use Instacart their same-day shipping service. [Walmart and Instacart together make up for nearly 50% of the online grocery sales.]( https://secondmeasure.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/GroceryDelivery-chart2png-1024x631.png) Walmart’s vast inventory and Instacart their network and experience will only strengthen their position as the dominant grocery delivery providers, and thus putting more pressure on Amazon.
- Partnership with Shopify
In addition to Instacart Walmart has also partnered with Shopify. This new partnership will allow third-party sellers to directly sell their item’s on the Walmart marketplace. This new partnership will greatly expand Walmart’s inventory while giving small businesses the opportunity to reach a bigger demographic. Walmart is expecting to add 1200 Shopify sellers in 2020. Listing an item on Walmart’s marketplace allows Walmart to pick up some fees and generate greater traffic to the website. Another interesting possibility to consider is the fact that Walmart could be used as a Shopify returns hub, with a Walmart being within 10 miles of 90% of the US population it is the ideal candidate for further strengthening their relation with Shopify and saving both parties a lot of money.
- Partnership with ThredUp
Walmart has also partnered with Thredup. ThredUp is basically an online thrift shop for clothes and wearable’s. This brilliant partnership means Walmart can now offer both normal and high-end clothing on their marketplace for an affordable price and expose customers to nearly 750,000 pre-owned items. Who would’ve ever thought you could tell someone that you bought your Michael Kors or Calvin Klein at Walmart.
- Google
Walmart has been partners with Google for over 3 years now. This partnership allowed Walmart to enter the domain of voice ordering groceries. Simply ask one of your Google devices to buy milk and it will add milk to your Shopping cart. This Partnership might just be the beginning of a strong bond between Google and Walmart as both companies are interested in competing with Amazon.
- Microsoft (+ Possible TikTok acquisition)
Walmart has been partnered with Microsoft for about 2 years with 3 more years to go.
Since the partnership Walmart has been using the full range of Microsoft cloud solutions in a bid to accelerate their digital transformation, innovation and efficiency.
Acquisitions
- Bonobos, ModCloth, ShoeBuy, Moosejaw, Parcel
Let’s start at the beginning, with these acquisitions Walmart stated entering the e-commerce market in 2016-2017. Sadly as is known none of these are particularly success stories with the companies being sold again, being discontinued or CEO’s leaving. However Walmart learned a lot from these companies and has used this knowledge to further try to expand in the e-commerce market.
- Jet.com
The first big step in the fight against Amazon. When amazon acquired Jet.com it was a clear signal of what its intentions were. Jet.com was one of the fastest growing U.S. e-commerce companies and Walmart acquired them in September 2016. Since then a lot has happened, Jet.com has been discontinued but the knowledge, progress and technology gained due to Jet.com is irreplaceable and has given Walmart a brilliant boost into the e-commerce with their e-commerce sales increasing 29%. Furthermore (ex)CEO of jet.com Marc Lore is now the CEO of Walmart’s e-commerce.
- Flipkart
Ever heard of the small startup company called Flipkart? Maybe you have not, you should though. Flipkart owns 35% of the Indian e-commerce market, a true giant. Walmart acquired Flipkart in 2018 and ever since then it has been expanding its influence in India and fighting against Amazon for market dominance. This year Flipkart took over Walmart’s 28 Indian stores in order to expand its wholesale growth. Another interesting thing is that Walmart might make Flipkart public within the next 3 years.
- TikTok acquisition
Some very recent news of their Partnership with Microsoft is to potentially acquire TikTok. TikTok’s enormous userbase and the current pressure in the US and India have made for an interesting situation causing the partnership to push forward in the bid to acquiring TikTok. In my opinion Walmart has a very decent chance of getting TikTok and making it work. One factor that plays a big role in this is Walmart’s presence in India due to Flipkart. Flipkart is India’s biggest online store for; phones, electronics, books, home appliances, etc. With Walmart having a presence in both countries where TikTok is (going to be) banned might mean some positive things for the future, but for now that is speculation. The acquisition of TikTok would allow Walmart to use its genius algorithm and massive userbase to further promote and integrate its Walmart marketplace.
Walmart PLUS
Word is finally out, in September Walmart will be launching its Amazon competitor called Walmart plus. It will give numerous benefits to the user such as; Unlimited free delivery(with 2700 stores having same day delivery), fuel discounts and scan&go a tool to make shopping faster, all for the price of $98 per year
2 Hour Delivery
Walmart recently launches its new delivery service, called Express Delivery. This new service will allow customers to place their order online and receive their groceries (for a 10$ fee) within 2 hours. Walmart express delivery is currently available in 800 stores with plans to expand to 2000 stores. In addition to 2 hour delivery Walmart also offers same-day delivery in almost the entire United States.
5000+ US stores.
This is Walmart’s biggest weapon. The thing Amazon lacks the most is physical stores. Walmart has over 5000 stores while Amazon has just over 600 (worldwide!). If Walmart can find a way to combine e-commerce with its enormous physical presence then it could give Amazon an absolute run for its money. Remember that 90% of Americans live within 10 miles of a Walmart.
Some other interesting facts to consider.
- 90% of US population live within 10miles of a Walmart.
- Walmart’s e-commerce sales are currently up 97%
- Walmart’s expansion in Africa, India, China.

Conclusion/TLDR
Let me first state with you that this has been my first Due Dilligence and that English is not my first language.
Walmart is currently the underdog, and not many people are expecting them to properly fight Amazon. However its recent spree of partnerships and acquisitions have been a brilliant and very clear move in the direction of e-commerce. If Walmart fully utilized its massive physical network together when their growing fresh e-commerce, I see no other outcome then for Walmart to grow, grow, grow. Covid has given Walmart customers the push they needed to fully explore Walmart their marketplace, the marketplace that is now starting to fill up with thousands of sellers and endless products. Walmart VS Amazon, here we go, my money is on Walmart.
Sources:
Instacart:
https://secondmeasure.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/GroceryDelivery-chart2png-1024x631.png
https://www.forbes.com/sites/walterloeb/2020/08/12/walmart-teams-up-with-instacart-to-rival-amazons-fast-grocery-delivery/#3bde97546010
https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/11/21363507/walmart-instacart-partnership-same-day-grocery-delivery-amazon-whole-foods-rivalry
Shopify:
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/06/15/walmart-expands-its-ecommerce-marketplace-to-more-small-businesses
https://techcrunch.com/2020/06/15/walmart-partners-with-shopify-to-expand-its-online-marketplace/
https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherwalton/2020/06/15/walmarts-new-shopify-partnership-is-another-stroke-of-digital-genius/#26a4e18e3025
ThredUp
https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherwalton/2020/06/05/walmarts-thredup-partnership-is-the-best-digital-move-walmart-has-made-in-the-last-3-years/#265d62952172
https://www.walmart.com/browse/clothing/thredup-shop-all/5438_6272369_7404214
Google:
https://techcrunch.com/2019/04/02/walmart-partners-with-google-on-voice-enabled-grocery-shopping/
https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/22/walmart-and-google-partner-on-voice-based-shopping/
Microsoft + TikTok
https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/22/walmart-and-google-partner-on-voice-based-shopping/
https://news.microsoft.com/2018/07/16/walmart-establishes-strategic-partnership-with-microsoft-to-further-accelerate-digital-innovation-in-retail/
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/08/28/tech/walmart-tiktok-bid-hnk-intl/index.html
Bonobos, ModCloth, ShoeBuy, Moosejaw, Parcel
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/markets/102315/top-4-companies-owned-walmart.asp
Jet.com
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/20/walmart-ceo-on-buying-jetcom-we-would-do-that-all-over-again.html
https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/05/20/jetcom-may-be-history-but-walmart-got-what-it-need.aspx
Flipkart
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/small-biz/startups/newsbuzz/flipkart-to-acquire-walmart-indias-wholesale-business/articleshow/77122766.cms
https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights/latest-news-headlines/flipkart-is-no-1-in-india-but-faces-formidable-foe-in-amazon-say-experts-54083920
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/07/23/walmarts-majority-owned-flipkart-launches-wholesale-business-to-help-small-businesses-in-india-source-directly-from-manufacturers-and-producers
https://www.livemint.com/companies/news/will-flipkart-ipo-set-the-ball-rolling-for-indian-unicorns-1561489450378.html
Walmart PLUS
https://www.tomsguide.com/news/walmart-plus-price-launch-date-and-everything-you-need-to-know
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/09/01/walmart-introduces-walmart
2 hour delivery
https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/30/21243557/walmart-express-delivery-two-hour-groceries-electronics#:~:text=Walmart%20is%20launching%20a%20new,during%20the%20COVID%2D19%20pandemic.
https://www.roadie.com/resources/press-releases/walmart-grocery-delivery
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/05/12/the-why-and-how-behind-walmart-express-delivery?irgwc=1&sourceid=imp_0iY1nOXZ4xyOUzQwUx0Mo3EHUkiVmiRxgxJy140&veh=aff&wmlspartner=imp_1943169&clickid=0iY1nOXZ4xyOUzQwUx0Mo3EHUkiVmiRxgxJy140&sharedid=
submitted by StonksArthur to Undervalued [link] [comments]


2020.09.01 20:27 StonksArthur Walmart VS Amazon, the next big online retailer (Walmart DD). Why my money is on Walmart

Walmart Due Dilligence
PARTNERSHIPS
- Partnership with Instacart
Recently Walmart and Instacart have founded a partnership that will allow Walmart to use Instacart their same-day shipping service. [Walmart and Instacart together make up for nearly 50% of the online grocery sales.]( https://secondmeasure.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/GroceryDelivery-chart2png-1024x631.png) Walmart’s vast inventory and Instacart their network and experience will only strengthen their position as the dominant grocery delivery providers, and thus putting more pressure on Amazon.
- Partnership with Shopify
In addition to Instacart Walmart has also partnered with Shopify. This new partnership will allow third-party sellers to directly sell their item’s on the Walmart marketplace. This new partnership will greatly expand Walmart’s inventory while giving small businesses the opportunity to reach a bigger demographic. Walmart is expecting to add 1200 Shopify sellers in 2020. Listing an item on Walmart’s marketplace allows Walmart to pick up some fees and generate greater traffic to the website. Another interesting possibility to consider is the fact that Walmart could be used as a Shopify returns hub, with a Walmart being within 10 miles of 90% of the US population it is the ideal candidate for further strengthening their relation with Shopify and saving both parties a lot of money.
- Partnership with ThredUp
Walmart has also partnered with Thredup. ThredUp is basically an online thrift shop for clothes and wearable’s. This brilliant partnership means Walmart can now offer both normal and high-end clothing on their marketplace for an affordable price and expose customers to nearly 750,000 pre-owned items. Who would’ve ever thought you could tell someone that you bought your Michael Kors or Calvin Klein at Walmart.
- Google
Walmart has been partners with Google for over 3 years now. This partnership allowed Walmart to enter the domain of voice ordering groceries. Simply ask one of your Google devices to buy milk and it will add milk to your Shopping cart. This Partnership might just be the beginning of a strong bond between Google and Walmart as both companies are interested in competing with Amazon.
- Microsoft (+ Possible TikTok acquisition)
Walmart has been partnered with Microsoft for about 2 years with 3 more years to go.
Since the partnership Walmart has been using the full range of Microsoft cloud solutions in a bid to accelerate their digital transformation, innovation and efficiency.
Acquisitions
- Bonobos, ModCloth, ShoeBuy, Moosejaw, Parcel
Let’s start at the beginning, with these acquisitions Walmart stated entering the e-commerce market in 2016-2017. Sadly as is known none of these are particularly success stories with the companies being sold again, being discontinued or CEO’s leaving. However Walmart learned a lot from these companies and has used this knowledge to further try to expand in the e-commerce market.
- Jet.com
The first big step in the fight against Amazon. When amazon acquired Jet.com it was a clear signal of what its intentions were. Jet.com was one of the fastest growing U.S. e-commerce companies and Walmart acquired them in September 2016. Since then a lot has happened, Jet.com has been discontinued but the knowledge, progress and technology gained due to Jet.com is irreplaceable and has given Walmart a brilliant boost into the e-commerce with their e-commerce sales increasing 29%. Furthermore (ex)CEO of jet.com Marc Lore is now the CEO of Walmart’s e-commerce.
- Flipkart
Ever heard of the small startup company called Flipkart? Maybe you have not, you should though. Flipkart owns 35% of the Indian e-commerce market, a true giant. Walmart acquired Flipkart in 2018 and ever since then it has been expanding its influence in India and fighting against Amazon for market dominance. This year Flipkart took over Walmart’s 28 Indian stores in order to expand its wholesale growth. Another interesting thing is that Walmart might make Flipkart public within the next 3 years.
- TikTok acquisition
Some very recent news of their Partnership with Microsoft is to potentially acquire TikTok. TikTok’s enormous userbase and the current pressure in the US and India have made for an interesting situation causing the partnership to push forward in the bid to acquiring TikTok. In my opinion Walmart has a very decent chance of getting TikTok and making it work. One factor that plays a big role in this is Walmart’s presence in India due to Flipkart. Flipkart is India’s biggest online store for; phones, electronics, books, home appliances, etc. With Walmart having a presence in both countries where TikTok is (going to be) banned might mean some positive things for the future, but for now that is speculation. The acquisition of TikTok would allow Walmart to use its genius algorithm and massive userbase to further promote and integrate its Walmart marketplace.
Walmart PLUS
Word is finally out, in September Walmart will be launching its Amazon competitor called Walmart plus. It will give numerous benefits to the user such as; Unlimited free delivery(with 2700 stores having same day delivery), fuel discounts and scan&go a tool to make shopping faster, all for the price of $98 per year
2 Hour Delivery
Walmart recently launches its new delivery service, called Express Delivery. This new service will allow customers to place their order online and receive their groceries (for a 10$ fee) within 2 hours. Walmart express delivery is currently available in 800 stores with plans to expand to 2000 stores. In addition to 2 hour delivery Walmart also offers same-day delivery in almost the entire United States.
5000+ US stores.
This is Walmart’s biggest weapon. The thing Amazon lacks the most is physical stores. Walmart has over 5000 stores while Amazon has just over 600 (worldwide!). If Walmart can find a way to combine e-commerce with its enormous physical presence then it could give Amazon an absolute run for its money. Remember that 90% of Americans live within 10 miles of a Walmart.
Some other interesting facts to consider.
- 90% of US population live within 10miles of a Walmart.
- Walmart’s e-commerce sales are currently up 97%
- Walmart’s expansion in Africa, India, China.

Conclusion/TLDR
Let me first state with you that this has been my first Due Dilligence and that English is not my first language.
Walmart is currently the underdog, and not many people are expecting them to properly fight Amazon. However its recent spree of partnerships and acquisitions have been a brilliant and very clear move in the direction of e-commerce. If Walmart fully utilized its massive physical network together when their growing fresh e-commerce, I see no other outcome then for Walmart to grow, grow, grow. Covid has given Walmart customers the push they needed to fully explore Walmart their marketplace, the marketplace that is now starting to fill up with thousands of sellers and endless products. Walmart VS Amazon, here we go, my money is on Walmart.
Sources:
Instacart:
https://secondmeasure.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/GroceryDelivery-chart2png-1024x631.png
https://www.forbes.com/sites/walterloeb/2020/08/12/walmart-teams-up-with-instacart-to-rival-amazons-fast-grocery-delivery/#3bde97546010
https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/11/21363507/walmart-instacart-partnership-same-day-grocery-delivery-amazon-whole-foods-rivalry
Shopify:
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/06/15/walmart-expands-its-ecommerce-marketplace-to-more-small-businesses
https://techcrunch.com/2020/06/15/walmart-partners-with-shopify-to-expand-its-online-marketplace/
https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherwalton/2020/06/15/walmarts-new-shopify-partnership-is-another-stroke-of-digital-genius/#26a4e18e3025
ThredUp
https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherwalton/2020/06/05/walmarts-thredup-partnership-is-the-best-digital-move-walmart-has-made-in-the-last-3-years/#265d62952172
https://www.walmart.com/browse/clothing/thredup-shop-all/5438_6272369_7404214
Google:
https://techcrunch.com/2019/04/02/walmart-partners-with-google-on-voice-enabled-grocery-shopping/
https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/22/walmart-and-google-partner-on-voice-based-shopping/
Microsoft + TikTok
https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/22/walmart-and-google-partner-on-voice-based-shopping/
https://news.microsoft.com/2018/07/16/walmart-establishes-strategic-partnership-with-microsoft-to-further-accelerate-digital-innovation-in-retail/
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/08/28/tech/walmart-tiktok-bid-hnk-intl/index.html
Bonobos, ModCloth, ShoeBuy, Moosejaw, Parcel
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/markets/102315/top-4-companies-owned-walmart.asp
Jet.com
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/20/walmart-ceo-on-buying-jetcom-we-would-do-that-all-over-again.html
https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/05/20/jetcom-may-be-history-but-walmart-got-what-it-need.aspx
Flipkart
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/small-biz/startups/newsbuzz/flipkart-to-acquire-walmart-indias-wholesale-business/articleshow/77122766.cms
https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights/latest-news-headlines/flipkart-is-no-1-in-india-but-faces-formidable-foe-in-amazon-say-experts-54083920
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/07/23/walmarts-majority-owned-flipkart-launches-wholesale-business-to-help-small-businesses-in-india-source-directly-from-manufacturers-and-producers
https://www.livemint.com/companies/news/will-flipkart-ipo-set-the-ball-rolling-for-indian-unicorns-1561489450378.html
Walmart PLUS
https://www.tomsguide.com/news/walmart-plus-price-launch-date-and-everything-you-need-to-know
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/09/01/walmart-introduces-walmart
2 hour delivery
https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/30/21243557/walmart-express-delivery-two-hour-groceries-electronics#:~:text=Walmart%20is%20launching%20a%20new,during%20the%20COVID%2D19%20pandemic.
https://www.roadie.com/resources/press-releases/walmart-grocery-delivery
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/05/12/the-why-and-how-behind-walmart-express-delivery?irgwc=1&sourceid=imp_0iY1nOXZ4xyOUzQwUx0Mo3EHUkiVmiRxgxJy140&veh=aff&wmlspartner=imp_1943169&clickid=0iY1nOXZ4xyOUzQwUx0Mo3EHUkiVmiRxgxJy140&sharedid=
submitted by StonksArthur to StockMarket [link] [comments]


2020.09.01 20:24 StonksArthur Walmart VS Amazon, the next big online retailer (Walmart DD). Why my money is on Walmart

Walmart Due Dilligence
PARTNERSHIPS
- Partnership with Instacart
Recently Walmart and Instacart have founded a partnership that will allow Walmart to use Instacart their same-day shipping service. [Walmart and Instacart together make up for nearly 50% of the online grocery sales.]( https://secondmeasure.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/GroceryDelivery-chart2png-1024x631.png) Walmart’s vast inventory and Instacart their network and experience will only strengthen their position as the dominant grocery delivery providers, and thus putting more pressure on Amazon.
- Partnership with Shopify
In addition to Instacart Walmart has also partnered with Shopify. This new partnership will allow third-party sellers to directly sell their item’s on the Walmart marketplace. This new partnership will greatly expand Walmart’s inventory while giving small businesses the opportunity to reach a bigger demographic. Walmart is expecting to add 1200 Shopify sellers in 2020. Listing an item on Walmart’s marketplace allows Walmart to pick up some fees and generate greater traffic to the website. Another interesting possibility to consider is the fact that Walmart could be used as a Shopify returns hub, with a Walmart being within 10 miles of 90% of the US population it is the ideal candidate for further strengthening their relation with Shopify and saving both parties a lot of money.
- Partnership with ThredUp
Walmart has also partnered with Thredup. ThredUp is basically an online thrift shop for clothes and wearable’s. This brilliant partnership means Walmart can now offer both normal and high-end clothing on their marketplace for an affordable price and expose customers to nearly 750,000 pre-owned items. Who would’ve ever thought you could tell someone that you bought your Michael Kors or Calvin Klein at Walmart.
- Google
Walmart has been partners with Google for over 3 years now. This partnership allowed Walmart to enter the domain of voice ordering groceries. Simply ask one of your Google devices to buy milk and it will add milk to your Shopping cart. This Partnership might just be the beginning of a strong bond between Google and Walmart as both companies are interested in competing with Amazon.
- Microsoft (+ Possible TikTok acquisition)
Walmart has been partnered with Microsoft for about 2 years with 3 more years to go.
Since the partnership Walmart has been using the full range of Microsoft cloud solutions in a bid to accelerate their digital transformation, innovation and efficiency.
Acquisitions
- Bonobos, ModCloth, ShoeBuy, Moosejaw, Parcel
Let’s start at the beginning, with these acquisitions Walmart stated entering the e-commerce market in 2016-2017. Sadly as is known none of these are particularly success stories with the companies being sold again, being discontinued or CEO’s leaving. However Walmart learned a lot from these companies and has used this knowledge to further try to expand in the e-commerce market.
- Jet.com
The first big step in the fight against Amazon. When amazon acquired Jet.com it was a clear signal of what its intentions were. Jet.com was one of the fastest growing U.S. e-commerce companies and Walmart acquired them in September 2016. Since then a lot has happened, Jet.com has been discontinued but the knowledge, progress and technology gained due to Jet.com is irreplaceable and has given Walmart a brilliant boost into the e-commerce with their e-commerce sales increasing 29%. Furthermore (ex)CEO of jet.com Marc Lore is now the CEO of Walmart’s e-commerce.
- Flipkart
Ever heard of the small startup company called Flipkart? Maybe you have not, you should though. Flipkart owns 35% of the Indian e-commerce market, a true giant. Walmart acquired Flipkart in 2018 and ever since then it has been expanding its influence in India and fighting against Amazon for market dominance. This year Flipkart took over Walmart’s 28 Indian stores in order to expand its wholesale growth. Another interesting thing is that Walmart might make Flipkart public within the next 3 years.
- TikTok acquisition
Some very recent news of their Partnership with Microsoft is to potentially acquire TikTok. TikTok’s enormous userbase and the current pressure in the US and India have made for an interesting situation causing the partnership to push forward in the bid to acquiring TikTok. In my opinion Walmart has a very decent chance of getting TikTok and making it work. One factor that plays a big role in this is Walmart’s presence in India due to Flipkart. Flipkart is India’s biggest online store for; phones, electronics, books, home appliances, etc. With Walmart having a presence in both countries where TikTok is (going to be) banned might mean some positive things for the future, but for now that is speculation. The acquisition of TikTok would allow Walmart to use its genius algorithm and massive userbase to further promote and integrate its Walmart marketplace.
Walmart PLUS
Word is finally out, in September Walmart will be launching its Amazon competitor called Walmart plus. It will give numerous benefits to the user such as; Unlimited free delivery(with 2700 stores having same day delivery), fuel discounts and scan&go a tool to make shopping faster, all for the price of $98 per year
2 Hour Delivery
Walmart recently launches its new delivery service, called Express Delivery. This new service will allow customers to place their order online and receive their groceries (for a 10$ fee) within 2 hours. Walmart express delivery is currently available in 800 stores with plans to expand to 2000 stores. In addition to 2 hour delivery Walmart also offers same-day delivery in almost the entire United States.
5000+ US stores.
This is Walmart’s biggest weapon. The thing Amazon lacks the most is physical stores. Walmart has over 5000 stores while Amazon has just over 600 (worldwide!). If Walmart can find a way to combine e-commerce with its enormous physical presence then it could give Amazon an absolute run for its money. Remember that 90% of Americans live within 10 miles of a Walmart.
Some other interesting facts to consider.
- 90% of US population live within 10miles of a Walmart.
- Walmart’s e-commerce sales are currently up 97%
- Walmart’s expansion in Africa, India, China.

Conclusion/TLDR
Let me first state with you that this has been my first Due Dilligence and that English is not my first language.
Walmart is currently the underdog, and not many people are expecting them to properly fight Amazon. However its recent spree of partnerships and acquisitions have been a brilliant and very clear move in the direction of e-commerce. If Walmart fully utilized its massive physical network together when their growing fresh e-commerce, I see no other outcome then for Walmart to grow, grow, grow. Covid has given Walmart customers the push they needed to fully explore Walmart their marketplace, the marketplace that is now starting to fill up with thousands of sellers and endless products. Walmart VS Amazon, here we go, my money is on Walmart.
Sources:
Instacart:
https://secondmeasure.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/GroceryDelivery-chart2png-1024x631.png
https://www.forbes.com/sites/walterloeb/2020/08/12/walmart-teams-up-with-instacart-to-rival-amazons-fast-grocery-delivery/#3bde97546010
https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/11/21363507/walmart-instacart-partnership-same-day-grocery-delivery-amazon-whole-foods-rivalry
Shopify:
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/06/15/walmart-expands-its-ecommerce-marketplace-to-more-small-businesses
https://techcrunch.com/2020/06/15/walmart-partners-with-shopify-to-expand-its-online-marketplace/
https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherwalton/2020/06/15/walmarts-new-shopify-partnership-is-another-stroke-of-digital-genius/#26a4e18e3025
ThredUp
https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherwalton/2020/06/05/walmarts-thredup-partnership-is-the-best-digital-move-walmart-has-made-in-the-last-3-years/#265d62952172
https://www.walmart.com/browse/clothing/thredup-shop-all/5438_6272369_7404214
Google:
https://techcrunch.com/2019/04/02/walmart-partners-with-google-on-voice-enabled-grocery-shopping/
https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/22/walmart-and-google-partner-on-voice-based-shopping/
Microsoft + TikTok
https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/22/walmart-and-google-partner-on-voice-based-shopping/
https://news.microsoft.com/2018/07/16/walmart-establishes-strategic-partnership-with-microsoft-to-further-accelerate-digital-innovation-in-retail/
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/08/28/tech/walmart-tiktok-bid-hnk-intl/index.html
Bonobos, ModCloth, ShoeBuy, Moosejaw, Parcel
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/markets/102315/top-4-companies-owned-walmart.asp
Jet.com
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/20/walmart-ceo-on-buying-jetcom-we-would-do-that-all-over-again.html
https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/05/20/jetcom-may-be-history-but-walmart-got-what-it-need.aspx
Flipkart
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/small-biz/startups/newsbuzz/flipkart-to-acquire-walmart-indias-wholesale-business/articleshow/77122766.cms
https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights/latest-news-headlines/flipkart-is-no-1-in-india-but-faces-formidable-foe-in-amazon-say-experts-54083920
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/07/23/walmarts-majority-owned-flipkart-launches-wholesale-business-to-help-small-businesses-in-india-source-directly-from-manufacturers-and-producers
https://www.livemint.com/companies/news/will-flipkart-ipo-set-the-ball-rolling-for-indian-unicorns-1561489450378.html
Walmart PLUS
https://www.tomsguide.com/news/walmart-plus-price-launch-date-and-everything-you-need-to-know
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/09/01/walmart-introduces-walmart
2 hour delivery
https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/30/21243557/walmart-express-delivery-two-hour-groceries-electronics#:~:text=Walmart%20is%20launching%20a%20new,during%20the%20COVID%2D19%20pandemic.
https://www.roadie.com/resources/press-releases/walmart-grocery-delivery
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/05/12/the-why-and-how-behind-walmart-express-delivery?irgwc=1&sourceid=imp_0iY1nOXZ4xyOUzQwUx0Mo3EHUkiVmiRxgxJy140&veh=aff&wmlspartner=imp_1943169&clickid=0iY1nOXZ4xyOUzQwUx0Mo3EHUkiVmiRxgxJy140&sharedid=
submitted by StonksArthur to economy [link] [comments]


2020.09.01 20:22 StonksArthur Walmart VS Amazon, the next big online retailer (Walmart DD). Why my money is on Walmart

Walmart Due Dilligence
PARTNERSHIPS
- Partnership with Instacart
Recently Walmart and Instacart have founded a partnership that will allow Walmart to use Instacart their same-day shipping service. [Walmart and Instacart together make up for nearly 50% of the online grocery sales.]( https://secondmeasure.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/GroceryDelivery-chart2png-1024x631.png) Walmart’s vast inventory and Instacart their network and experience will only strengthen their position as the dominant grocery delivery providers, and thus putting more pressure on Amazon.
- Partnership with Shopify
In addition to Instacart Walmart has also partnered with Shopify. This new partnership will allow third-party sellers to directly sell their item’s on the Walmart marketplace. This new partnership will greatly expand Walmart’s inventory while giving small businesses the opportunity to reach a bigger demographic. Walmart is expecting to add 1200 Shopify sellers in 2020. Listing an item on Walmart’s marketplace allows Walmart to pick up some fees and generate greater traffic to the website. Another interesting possibility to consider is the fact that Walmart could be used as a Shopify returns hub, with a Walmart being within 10 miles of 90% of the US population it is the ideal candidate for further strengthening their relation with Shopify and saving both parties a lot of money.
- Partnership with ThredUp
Walmart has also partnered with Thredup. ThredUp is basically an online thrift shop for clothes and wearable’s. This brilliant partnership means Walmart can now offer both normal and high-end clothing on their marketplace for an affordable price and expose customers to nearly 750,000 pre-owned items. Who would’ve ever thought you could tell someone that you bought your Michael Kors or Calvin Klein at Walmart.
- Google
Walmart has been partners with Google for over 3 years now. This partnership allowed Walmart to enter the domain of voice ordering groceries. Simply ask one of your Google devices to buy milk and it will add milk to your Shopping cart. This Partnership might just be the beginning of a strong bond between Google and Walmart as both companies are interested in competing with Amazon.
- Microsoft (+ Possible TikTok acquisition)
Walmart has been partnered with Microsoft for about 2 years with 3 more years to go.
Since the partnership Walmart has been using the full range of Microsoft cloud solutions in a bid to accelerate their digital transformation, innovation and efficiency.
Acquisitions
- Bonobos, ModCloth, ShoeBuy, Moosejaw, Parcel
Let’s start at the beginning, with these acquisitions Walmart stated entering the e-commerce market in 2016-2017. Sadly as is known none of these are particularly success stories with the companies being sold again, being discontinued or CEO’s leaving. However Walmart learned a lot from these companies and has used this knowledge to further try to expand in the e-commerce market.
- Jet.com
The first big step in the fight against Amazon. When amazon acquired Jet.com it was a clear signal of what its intentions were. Jet.com was one of the fastest growing U.S. e-commerce companies and Walmart acquired them in September 2016. Since then a lot has happened, Jet.com has been discontinued but the knowledge, progress and technology gained due to Jet.com is irreplaceable and has given Walmart a brilliant boost into the e-commerce with their e-commerce sales increasing 29%. Furthermore (ex)CEO of jet.com Marc Lore is now the CEO of Walmart’s e-commerce.
- Flipkart
Ever heard of the small startup company called Flipkart? Maybe you have not, you should though. Flipkart owns 35% of the Indian e-commerce market, a true giant. Walmart acquired Flipkart in 2018 and ever since then it has been expanding its influence in India and fighting against Amazon for market dominance. This year Flipkart took over Walmart’s 28 Indian stores in order to expand its wholesale growth. Another interesting thing is that Walmart might make Flipkart public within the next 3 years.
- TikTok acquisition
Some very recent news of their Partnership with Microsoft is to potentially acquire TikTok. TikTok’s enormous userbase and the current pressure in the US and India have made for an interesting situation causing the partnership to push forward in the bid to acquiring TikTok. In my opinion Walmart has a very decent chance of getting TikTok and making it work. One factor that plays a big role in this is Walmart’s presence in India due to Flipkart. Flipkart is India’s biggest online store for; phones, electronics, books, home appliances, etc. With Walmart having a presence in both countries where TikTok is (going to be) banned might mean some positive things for the future, but for now that is speculation. The acquisition of TikTok would allow Walmart to use its genius algorithm and massive userbase to further promote and integrate its Walmart marketplace.
Walmart PLUS
Word is finally out, in September Walmart will be launching its Amazon competitor called Walmart plus. It will give numerous benefits to the user such as; Unlimited free delivery(with 2700 stores having same day delivery), fuel discounts and scan&go a tool to make shopping faster, all for the price of $98 per year
2 Hour Delivery
Walmart recently launches its new delivery service, called Express Delivery. This new service will allow customers to place their order online and receive their groceries (for a 10$ fee) within 2 hours. Walmart express delivery is currently available in 800 stores with plans to expand to 2000 stores. In addition to 2 hour delivery Walmart also offers same-day delivery in almost the entire United States.
5000+ US stores.
This is Walmart’s biggest weapon. The thing Amazon lacks the most is physical stores. Walmart has over 5000 stores while Amazon has just over 600 (worldwide!). If Walmart can find a way to combine e-commerce with its enormous physical presence then it could give Amazon an absolute run for its money. Remember that 90% of Americans live within 10 miles of a Walmart.
Some other interesting facts to consider.
- 90% of US population live within 10miles of a Walmart.
- Walmart’s e-commerce sales are currently up 97%
- Walmart’s expansion in Africa, India, China.

Conclusion/TLDR
Let me first state with you that this has been my first Due Dilligence and that English is not my first language.
Walmart is currently the underdog, and not many people are expecting them to properly fight Amazon. However its recent spree of partnerships and acquisitions have been a brilliant and very clear move in the direction of e-commerce. If Walmart fully utilized its massive physical network together when their growing fresh e-commerce, I see no other outcome then for Walmart to grow, grow, grow. Covid has given Walmart customers the push they needed to fully explore Walmart their marketplace, the marketplace that is now starting to fill up with thousands of sellers and endless products. Walmart VS Amazon, here we go, my money is on Walmart.
Sources:
Instacart:
https://secondmeasure.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/GroceryDelivery-chart2png-1024x631.png
https://www.forbes.com/sites/walterloeb/2020/08/12/walmart-teams-up-with-instacart-to-rival-amazons-fast-grocery-delivery/#3bde97546010
https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/11/21363507/walmart-instacart-partnership-same-day-grocery-delivery-amazon-whole-foods-rivalry
Shopify:
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/06/15/walmart-expands-its-ecommerce-marketplace-to-more-small-businesses
https://techcrunch.com/2020/06/15/walmart-partners-with-shopify-to-expand-its-online-marketplace/
https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherwalton/2020/06/15/walmarts-new-shopify-partnership-is-another-stroke-of-digital-genius/#26a4e18e3025
ThredUp
https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherwalton/2020/06/05/walmarts-thredup-partnership-is-the-best-digital-move-walmart-has-made-in-the-last-3-years/#265d62952172
https://www.walmart.com/browse/clothing/thredup-shop-all/5438_6272369_7404214
Google:
https://techcrunch.com/2019/04/02/walmart-partners-with-google-on-voice-enabled-grocery-shopping/
https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/22/walmart-and-google-partner-on-voice-based-shopping/
Microsoft + TikTok
https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/22/walmart-and-google-partner-on-voice-based-shopping/
https://news.microsoft.com/2018/07/16/walmart-establishes-strategic-partnership-with-microsoft-to-further-accelerate-digital-innovation-in-retail/
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/08/28/tech/walmart-tiktok-bid-hnk-intl/index.html
Bonobos, ModCloth, ShoeBuy, Moosejaw, Parcel
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/markets/102315/top-4-companies-owned-walmart.asp
Jet.com
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/20/walmart-ceo-on-buying-jetcom-we-would-do-that-all-over-again.html
https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/05/20/jetcom-may-be-history-but-walmart-got-what-it-need.aspx
Flipkart
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/small-biz/startups/newsbuzz/flipkart-to-acquire-walmart-indias-wholesale-business/articleshow/77122766.cms
https://www.spglobal.com/marketintelligence/en/news-insights/latest-news-headlines/flipkart-is-no-1-in-india-but-faces-formidable-foe-in-amazon-say-experts-54083920
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/07/23/walmarts-majority-owned-flipkart-launches-wholesale-business-to-help-small-businesses-in-india-source-directly-from-manufacturers-and-producers
https://www.livemint.com/companies/news/will-flipkart-ipo-set-the-ball-rolling-for-indian-unicorns-1561489450378.html
Walmart PLUS
https://www.tomsguide.com/news/walmart-plus-price-launch-date-and-everything-you-need-to-know
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/09/01/walmart-introduces-walmart
2 hour delivery
https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/30/21243557/walmart-express-delivery-two-hour-groceries-electronics#:~:text=Walmart%20is%20launching%20a%20new,during%20the%20COVID%2D19%20pandemic.
https://www.roadie.com/resources/press-releases/walmart-grocery-delivery
https://corporate.walmart.com/newsroom/2020/05/12/the-why-and-how-behind-walmart-express-delivery?irgwc=1&sourceid=imp_0iY1nOXZ4xyOUzQwUx0Mo3EHUkiVmiRxgxJy140&veh=aff&wmlspartner=imp_1943169&clickid=0iY1nOXZ4xyOUzQwUx0Mo3EHUkiVmiRxgxJy140&sharedid=
submitted by StonksArthur to stocks [link] [comments]


2020.09.01 14:16 dsut22 A background to Wood Green MOB

A background to Wood Green MOB

Wood Green MOB

A background into Wood Green MOB (Money Over Bitches), formerly known as Wood Green PBP (Paper Before Pussy,) Hoodfellas and Mobstarz, Wood Green, North London.



Wood Green (With Sky City Housing Estate behind The Mall Wood Green)


Many drill fans will certainly have heard of the Wood Green MOB group in drill as it's very active in the road scene, the fact that North London is pretty much the hottest place for gang rivalry, and its intense rivalry with certain other North and East End of London areas like South Tottenham, Hornsey and Hoxton, I've seen many other pages with talk about Wood Green MOB like the music they produce and more so about who they beef and the points scored between rival gangs, but for people new to UK Drill (or who do not know some of the history of the Wood Green MOB gang) I trust you will find the background to Wood Green MOB, and its actual precursors intriguing. It took me a while to gather information on a group widely known as other neighbouring London groups. I may do more of these, I could do 6th based in Beckton and maybe Manor Park based in the Manor Park and Cage area.

Locale


Based around the London Borough of Haringey, located on numerous estates throughout Wood Green including Sky City, the Sandlings, Noel Park, Commerce Road and Acacia Road all within the N22 postal district. Some of their territory has expanded to the New Southgate area of N11. 22 is another name for the gang and they have mainly been seen in North London in Wood Green on the Commerce Road. They are a very active gang and have been around for over 40 years dating back to the 1970s where drug dealers from Wood Green would offer people drugs to make money, they are very very closely allies with fellow North London area Edmonton, they are also one of North London’s most well known and active gangs, stemming even well before the days of the Dem Africans and Shankstarz. Wood Green MOB also go by #WG, #Block 2, #22 #LampzWorld, #GSH, #MelloCity, #N22 , #MOB , #GreenGang , #DBlock/DBMG. Wood Green is known as Mob City by many gang members and by locals.

.
Mob City

The Wood Green area borders Bowes Park (N13 and N22), Hornsey (N8), Palmers Green (N13) and Duckett's Green (N15). Many of their rivals are based in and around these areas, in particular South Tottenham and Hornsey.
Born from the ashes of old-school North London gang called Wood Green Firm or more commonly known as Firm, Wood Green then saw rap groups form more commonly though in the 2000s under the Wood Green MOB label and it quickly became a well known stomping ground for many of North London's well know and rising road rap talents, most notably Smokey (who was one of the originals in the road rap scene) and Brucey. Working under the Wood Green MOB and Wood Green PBP banner through the early 2010s, the gang quickly found a creative style of music on tunes like "F*** a Family," gradually making their presence known into London's road rap scene. As the sounds of London's road rap shifted, so did the duo's: their 2010s song, You Can Get Touched, saw the group delve into U.K.-style road rap/trap, while in the latter 2010's songs like , Looking For Who, helped to establish the Wood Green's presence on the burgeoning drill scene. It was in the 2010's decade that gangs truly made their mark: working with producers from MKThePlug to M1OnTheBeat, Wood Green gradually built a following with their disses to rivals and creative synergy. Marking their songs with the tag #Wood Green, the gang founded their drill collective just as Wood Green MOB, an homage to the ''Mob City'' area, where gang members will have grown up and represent.
A number of past and current generations of gangs have existed in Haringey and other London boroughs that associate with the colour red and blue, some of which in the past had also self-identified themselves as Bloods and Crips. One of the first of these was the short lived Cripset from Dorset Road which claimed affiliation to the Rollin 80's Crips in Los Angeles. The gang was most active throughout the mid 2000's and were rivals to 031 Bloods, now know simply as 031 (O-Tray One) based in the Patmore and Hartington estates. This is seen as a massive influence on London from the famous American rival gangs Bloods and Crips.
Wood Green MOB themselves have never claimed Crips or Bloods like their rivals have and they have always affiliated with the colour green.
There are a number of other gangs in London which have been linked with the colour red. The Ida Bloodstarz from Ida Road and Tottenham have always used the colour red, whilst the former gang EvaStrap (now known as Reed Road) in the borough of Haringey in which they are located had asubset nicknamed 'Reed Road Cripz' and can still be seen using blue bandanas to this day, this is due to the ongoing American influence.
Some of PBP/MOB's rivalries have identified with colours themselves such as Original Farm Boys who used to be known as just Broadwater Farm/Tottenham Mandem, identify with the colour red and also Northumberland Park Killers/NPK who used to be a part of the Tottenham Mandem gang collective, identify with the colour purple .

Current beef and alliances


Wood Green Firm and the current Wood Green MOB gang have had some of the same rivalries between gangs but some of the rivalries were rid of and have now become extinct during the current generation of the Wood Green MOB gang. The current generation of the mass rivalry in Haringey has overtaken the old school rivalry that was between Wood Green and Archway Mandem and Busy Blocks.
Wood Green MOB allies: 3x3/N9 (N9), 6th/ACG(Anyone Can Go)/Hammerville (E6)), 37/OJB (SW11), Touch Paper Lane (N15 and N22), Arnos Grove (N11 and N14) and 4BP (NW4).
Wood Green MOB rivalries: 6th/ACG(Anyone Can Go)/Hammerville (E6), Graveyard Fam (N2, N3, and N12), Northumberland Park Killers/NPK (N17), Original Farm Boys (N17), Hornsey Grey Gang/8th (N8), Grahame Park (NW9), Albany Park/Skengfield (EN3), N19/Busy Blocks (N19) and Hoxton (N1).

Early to mid 1990's


During the early 1990’s a gang known as the Firm was active across the north of London, first being and restricted to Tottenham but extending to incorporate nearby parts of Haringey such as Edmonton and Wood Green. By 1996-97 the different districts began to identify with their local area with their younger generations and so the Edmonton Firm and Wood Green Firm were formulated and this type of local district affiliation still happens widespread today. The Wood Green Firm birthed around Gladstone Avenue in Noel Park and on the Sandlings estates, which are main bases of Wood Green MOB today. Many members were educated at St Dorothy’s, St Katherine’s and Broomfield Schools in north London, and later Southgate College. The Sandlings and Sky City estates were the main area of activity from the beginning and later Sandlings was nicknamed ''Shell Town'', largely because the shotgun was once a favoured weapon as was its shells ammunition.
Wood Green and North London as a whole always had much of a multi-generational phases of gangs, which would have had each generation taking on their own identity and name, in comparison to other London Boroughs such as the Royal Borough of Greenwich, Lambeth and Waltham Forest. Sky City Estate and the Sandlings, where the Wood Green MOB gang was formed, had long had music being produced during the time which they descended into gang violence in the 1990's and mid 2000s, previously being called the gang Hoodfellas and City of Gods. In reports of the late 1990s, Wood Green and many areas of North London as a whole was characterized as deprived in income, employment, health and crime.
Wood Green dominated over the nearby Hornsey area which is where Hornsey Mandem developed was created, the two were close in alliance until 2008. Wood Green remained close with other ‘Firm’ areas Edmonton until 2003-04 and Tottenham until 2005, however, these area relationships in north London were later broken down by second and third iteration members and now beef today.

1997-1999


The first generation Wood Green Firm began to call themselves ‘Junior Mafia’ or ‘Junior Mafia Woodz’ in the late 1990’s and going into the millennium. The second generations became known collectively as Wood Green MOB – Money Over Bitches. Within the MOB’s sprawling turf, covering large parts of the N22 post code (known as 22nd Side), sets developed that were geographically placed on various estates such as the Avenues (Noel Park), Acacia Road, Bracknell Close and Progress Way, Commerce Road, the Sandlings and Sky City estates.
Following the death of a young Tottenham boy in 1997, perpetrated by the Hackney Mandem, members of the Wood Green Firm were firmly backing the conflict that came to be generalised as ‘Hackney versus Tottenham’. At this point in time Wood Green and Tottenham were close allies, Edmonton were also their allies. Although the conflict mainly concerned those from Broadwater Farm and London Fields estates, Wood Green counted Hackney as a rival.
By 1998, a host of gang names begun to exist under the umbrella of Wood Green MOB over the last several years including Shell Town Soldiers, Junior Mafia Woodz, Mobstarz, Hoodfellas, North Bangers, PBP (Paper Before Pussy), City of Gods and Mobcity Young Gunners / GSR. The names loosely denote various age generations of the gang, Wood Green MOB or Mobstarz remains as the collective identity. Wood Green is also known amongst other things as Mobcity. A second, separate gang forms across Wood Green and Tottenham and known as SK or Shadow Kings. They are a predominantly African set and do not have a set turf due to their focus not being banging but trapping. They are associated with the MOB and although not affiliated with TMD, often worked for them.

2000


A long-time defunct set called 1 Nation is formed after breaking away from the wider Shadow Kings

2001-02


Shadow Kings starts a heavy rivalry with Tottenham. This would be the first ever Wood Green vs Tottenham rivalry. Numerous lives were lost during this rivalry.
By 2001-02, there had been multiple murders, along with countless shootings and drug offences, which saw many of the first generation members imprisoned for long sentences. At this point the second and third generations of Wood Green were known as ‘Junior Mafia’ and as ‘Wood Green MOB’. The equivalent generations of Edmonton went on to become known as the Shankstarz whilst over a dozen Tottenham estates began to adopt their own identity, for example NPK (from Northumberland Park).
Many of the teenagers involved in this generation were known to one another as friends, having attended the same schools and having played football together, and through family ties. Despite this, the areas began to challenge each others reputation and it wasn’t long before this escalated into violence.
In 2002, up to a dozen members of the Wood Green MOB – the Junior Mafia Woodz – were caught by police surveillance following a four-month robbery spree. The gang members, aged 12-19, were said by police to see themselves as untouchable, preying on innocent victims as a pack to steal cash and mobile phones often at knifepoint. Jermaine Campbell (later sentenced for the murder of Andre Linton in 2005), Craig Johnson and Ashley Gowdie, all then 16, were ordered to be detained for three years despite being young offenders because their crimes were deemed so serious.
Up to 1,300 hours of surveillance film showed scenes of robbery taking place. The gang were identifiable by their trademark clothing of t-shirts with Loony tunes characters. Robbery offences were said to have fallen by 33% in Wood Green shopping centre following the convictions. The youths were said to have been led on robbery offences by older members of the gang Shane Reid and Marcus Downie. 2003

The third generation become known as Wood Green MOB + WGM (Wood Green Mandem). Their turf expands to cover large parts of the N22 post code (known as 22nd Side).
In 2003, the Shankstarz were involved in the stabbing of two teenagers, one from Wood Green and one from Tottenham. This generation of Wood Green, and NPK from Tottenham, were now rivals with nearby Lower Edmonton (N9).

2004


In 2004, Wood Green MOB were allies with a gang known as the Shadow Kings, a predominantly African gang whose members lived across Wood Green and Tottenham N17 areas. Shadow Kings, who were often present in Wood Green, began conflict with Tiverton from south Tottenham (who at the time had internal issues in Tottenham with Broadwater Farm). During the conflict Wood Green membership was torn between loyalties with Tottenham and the Shadow Kings. Those who sided with the Shadow Kings gained a new enemy in Tottenham. Wood Green-Tottenham beef begins.
The conflict with Edmonton was continued predominantly with NPK rather than Wood Green and resulted in numerous stabbings culminating with a series of convictions following a large outbreak of violent disorder on Hertford Road, Edmonton, in 2007. By this point in time Wood Green and Tottenham were no longer allies as a result of torn loyalties developing from disputes that occurred in 2005.

2005-2006


The fallout brought Tottenham back together, ending internal disputes that had not developed into anything too serious, and in 2005 the Wood Green MOB began serious conflict with Tottenham gangs, mainly Broadwater Farm, Ida Bloodstarz and Tiverton.
A growing number of shootings had been occurring between Tottenham and Wood Green in 2005. Furthermore, an 18-year-old and a 20-year-old male were gunned down in Tottenham and Wood Green the preceding years in murder cases that both remain unsolved.
Among the incidents in the run-up to the murder of Tottenham male, Andre Linton - an innocent victim of this feud, an 18-year-old was seriously wounded during a knife attack near Broadwater Farm whilst a 17-year-old was also injured in a drive-by shooting, also on the Farm. In the latter incident, local Member of Parliament David Lammy was there to attend to the shot boy. He later criticised police who refused to allow the ambulance to reach the victim after they had sealed the area off whilst carrying out a risk assessment. The victim, Charles Osei-Bonsu, suffered a gunshot wound to the shoulder.
In April 2005, the press picked up on the growing rivalry between MOB and the Farm, calling it an armed turf-war. In the week that preceded the article there had been reports of a drive-by shooting and a gunfight on West Green Road where eight shell cases were discovered. This was followed by another gunfight on Clarendon Road and police were later called to attend North Middlesex Hospital where a young man with gunshot wounds to the leg had presented himself.
In May 2005, 22-year-old Andre Linton was killed by a single bullet after his car was surrounded by members of the Wood Green MOB on Buller Road, Wood Green. Jermaine 'Killa' Campbell, then 19, was later charged with the murder. Andre, who was a pupil at Greig City Academy and formerly of Northumberland Park School, was not a gang member. It is believed the trigger was something as arbitrary as a 'dirty look'. Police were called to six reports of firearms that evening, it followed three seperate shootings that had taken place on Turnpike Lane and Broadwater Farm.
In total, there had been twenty recorded incidents of violent disorder involving guns or knives in the eight weeks prior to the murder. In one attack, an innocent eight-year-old child was injured during a hit-and-run when a car being driven by a gang fleeing the scene mounted the pavement. The tit-for-tat rivalry continued between Broadwater Farm, joined sometimes by other Tottenham gangs including Tiverton and Ida, against the Wood Green MOB. In October 2006, Wood Green MOB's Jerome Vassell, 19, was left fighting for his life after being shot in the head outside a talent show at the West Indian Cultural Centre in Clarendon Road, Hornsey. Vassell , also known as JV or Warlord, was allowed to leave Royal Free Hospital in Hampstead, however, he suffered severe brain damage that caused partial paralysis and communication problems. Green City alliance is formed between Wood Green, Edmonton Green, and Bounds Green. All three gangs begin wearing green bandanas.

2008


Those gangsters who were involved in Shadow Kings had now joined Wood Green MOB after many Shadow King members face imprisonment and longer sentences.
At the time of Jerome Vassell’s death, Wood Green had teamed up with once brief enemies from Edmonton who were now known as the Shankstarz. The link became popularised as the Green City alliance (Wood Green to Edmonton Green), with both gangs increasingly associating with the colour green and wearing of green clothing including bandanas. Wood Green were also linked with the Meridian Mandem (Meridian Crew and Bloodline music crew) and Palmers Green, referred to locally as P-Town. This generation of Wood Green also became allies to the London Fields Boys, another gang who the Wood Green olders once shared an extreme hatred of alongside their older Tottenham allies.
In 2008, long-term allies Hornsey and Wood Green began to fall into conflict with one another. A series of incidents contributed to the build up of the rivalry including a stabbing on Commerce Road estate in Wood Green, the victim was associated with Wood Green younger set ‘City of Gods’. A number of tit-for-tat incidents followed with robberies of Wood Green youngers by Hornsey, and attacks carried out by Warlordz and LMD sets.
Wood Green responded with similar violations against the Hornsey Grey Gang and it escalated throughout the rest of 2008. In one incident in September 2008, up to forty rivals fought a pitched battle on Lymington Avenue, Wood Green, during which a 17-year-old boy suffered serious stab wounds and was described as lucky to be alive. He was stabbed in the legs, back and face as the youths fought with sticks and bottles. Some of those involved were caught on CCTV in nearby Gladstone Road although their faces were concealed with bandanas. By the end of 2008 Hornsey Grey Gang had developed an alliance with Wood Green’s rivals from Tottenham including NPK.
Since 2008 a new wave of younger members have made headlines for minor offences typically associated with the early stages of gang evolvement. The Sky City and Sandlings estates continue to be a preferred hangout by aspiring gang members. The Sky City estate, which sits above Wood Green shopping mall, often makes local headlines for gang activity. In an unusual outcome in 2010, Haringey Council blocked plans for a dispersal zone on the estate, largely because the confines of the estate are not a public place (dispersal prevent loitering in public places).
With the relocation of a number of older members to Palmers Green the new younger sets have been left to run amok continuing age old rivalries with nearby gangs. Stabbings incidents have occurred frequently with young members in their early to mid teens. A 15-year-old boy was stabbed in Wood Green High Road on the day of the Royal Wedding, April 29th, after being chased through the town centre. He was stabbed repeatedly by a group of youths in broad daylight in what police believe was an attempted murder. The following month a teenager was knocked off his bike by a car on Darwin Road, Noel Park, before the occupants got out and stabbed him.

2010


In 2010 Michael Gaynor received an ASBO banning him from Wood Green for five years. The order also prevents him from associating with thirteen other members of the gang; from being in a group of three or more in a public place; from uploading pictures or footage that features green bandanas; and from featuring in any music video of audio material that is uploaded onto the internet and incites violence towards rival gangs.
Despite having had gang affiliations in Wood Green since his early youth G Money (Michael Gaynor) is one of the biggest names on the underground rap/road music scene. He was interviewed for MTV’s the Wrap Up in 2010 where he spoke about his early influences and the release of early Wood Green mixtape ‘Mobstarz Most Hated Vol 1’.
Michael Gaynor was one of two leading figures in the Wood Green MOB to receive recent ASBOs. Fellow member Rowan Lopez was banned from entering Wood Green from 2011 until 2013. It was an extension of an earlier ASBO he was granted in 2009. Like Gaynor, he has been prohibited from posting videos online showing him inciting people to violence and promoting gang activity and identity. Both males had long histories of offending going back to their teens including robbery and weapon offences. Another leading figure of the current olders was arrested and charged with possession with intent to supply class A drugs and sentenced to two years in 2011.
Another member of the Wood Green MOB, Terrence Abalola also known as Ghost, 18, was sentenced to four years in 2010. It came after a teenager arranged for his 15-year-old cousin to be beaten, robbed and sprayed with tear gas during a house robbery. Abalola led two other teens, all in masks, into the cousins home in Stoke Newington where they attacked the boy. They screamed at him ‘where’s your stuff’, at which point he recognised one of the voice having shared a McDonald’s meal with one of them in Wood Green just two days earlier. The three robbers fled with the boy’s TV, Xbox games console, laptop computer, mobile phone, £300 cash and his mothers iPod Touch.
The younger generational iterations of the gang begin to go by the various sets: Mobstarz City of Gods Hoodfellas North Bangers
Paper Before Pussy
They all collectively rep Wood Green and share in the same allies and and enemies.

2011 - present

After this the gangs in London started to drop the usage of Crips and Bloods into the gang names and began to use gang names that are more modern and still in usage as of the present day and that includes all Haringey based gang.
The current day allies of Wood Green continue to be the Shankstarz from Edmonton, who today are now known as 3x3, P-Town (Palmers Green), Arnos Grove, London Fields Boys formerly who have now cut ties with Wood Green MOB and have no ties to the current faction known as Zero Tolerance and the remaining former members of the now defunct Shadow Kings. There have been some links with Dem Africans (shared link with Shadow Kings) and Young Dem Africans, however the picture is less clear because the latter have historic roots in Tottenham, and Dem Africans have since become #900. Despite this, a senior member of the Wood Green MOB accompanied a handful of Young Dem African members to West Green Road, Tottenham, in September 2009 where they were fired at by a prominent member of the Ida Bloodstarz with a sub machine gun. All fled from the gunfire and escaped without serious injury. Another link, although less relevant owing to distance, is with MPR (Make Paper Regardless) who are from west London (Shepherd's Bush and South Acton). The association with MPR was built by members who were serving custodial sentences in a London prison.
Rappers/Drillers in the drill era from Wood Green MOB like Lampz and Jigga J took a foothold in the drill and gang life scene. Lampz aka Kelvin Odunuyi was a very well known gang member and was deeply hated by his enemies because pressurised Tottenham and Hoxton heavily. In 2018, at the Hollywood Wood Green cinema, a motorcycle that came down from Lordship Lane (the road that leads from Wood Green into the N17 postal district) drove towards the entrance of the cinema and one of the two on the motorcycle fired shots through the window and circled back to deliver a final fatal shot to the head of Odunuyi. Many saw it as a revenge attack for Odunuyi's alleged involvement in the death of Kobi Nelson, a former NPK member who reformed as an anti-crime campaigner, Jigga J was involved and sentenced to life for the death of Nelson.
submitted by dsut22 to ukdrill [link] [comments]


2020.08.30 20:22 Kingofearth23 Anonymity by State/Country: Comprehensive Global Guide III

Ever since i started playing regularly, i've researched anonymity in places. Here is what i have for each state plus a bunch of other countries. If anything is outdated or incorrect, please comment.
United States
Alabama: No current lottery. Source: https://www.wtvy.com/content/news/Lottery-bill-other-legislation-is-likely-dead-in-Alabama-legislature-569059451.html
Alaska: No current lottery/Not Anonymous. "Unlike most other states, Alaska doesn’t have a state-sponsored lottery." Source: https://www.lotterycritic.com/lottery-results/alaska/ Alaska does permit charities to run lotteries, the largest one is Not Anonymous. Source: http://www.lottoalaska.com/
Alaska's governor has proposed a bill to create an official Alaska State Lottery. Source: https://apnews.com/78cacca5137f6b47e41be2de37600044
American Samoa: No current lottery. Source: https://simonsblogpark.com/onlinegambling/simons-guide-to-gambling-in-american-samoa/amp/
Arizona: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner for all wins of $100,000 and over. Source: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/arizona-becomes-latest-state-shield-lottery-winners-names-n995696
Arkansas: Not Anonymous/Other entities unclear. "Winner information is subject to disclosure under the Arkansas Freedom of Information Act (FOIA). A winner who receives a prize or prize payment from the ASL grants the ASL, its agents, officers, employees, and representatives the right to use, publish (in print or by means of the Internet) and reproduce the winner’s name, physical likeness, photograph, portraits, and statements made by the winner, and use audio sound clips and video or film footage of the winner for the purpose of press releases, advertising, and promoting the ASL". Source: https://www.myarkansaslottery.com/claim-your-prize
California: Not Anonymous/Only individuals can claim. “ The name and location of the retailer who sold you the winning ticket, the date you won and the amount of your winnings are also matters of public record and are subject to disclosure. You can form a trust prior to claiming your prize, but our regulations do not allow a trust to claim a prize. Understand that your name is still public and reportable”. Source: https://static.www.calottery.com/~/media/Publications/Popular_Downloads/winners-handbook-October%202018-%20English.pdf
Colorado: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via trust. “As part of the Open Records Act, we are required to release to the public your name, hometown, amount you won and the game you played. This information will be posted on coloradolottery.com and will be furnished to media upon request.” Source: https://www.coloradolottery.com/en/games/lotto/claim-winnings/ Source: https://denver.cbslocal.com/2016/01/15/in-colorado-and-other-states-lottery-winners-can-keep-names-secret/
Connecticut: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via a trust or LLC, "Certain information about our winners is public information: Winner's name and place of residence, date of claim, game played, prize amount won, and the selling retailer's name and location. While most winners claim prizes using their individual names, some winners come forward using other legal entities (i.e., trusts, business partnership) to claim their prizes. In those instances, the Lottery will promote the win using that legal entity's name. For more information about such instances, please consult your personal accountant or legal advisor.” Source: https://www.ctlottery.org/Content/winner_publicity.aspx
Delaware: 100% Anonymous if requested by winner. "Many winners have chosen to remain anonymous, as allowed by state law, but their excitement is yours to share!" Source: https://www.delottery.com/Winners and https://www.delottery.com/FAQs
DC: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via a trust or LLC. Anonymous question is not directly answered on lottery website. "In the District of Columbia, specific lottery winner information is public record." However, a Powerball Jackpot win was claimed via a LLC in 2009. Source: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/05/04/AR2009050402008.html
Florida: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via LLC. "Florida Lottery winners cannot remain anonymous. Florida law mandates that the Florida Lottery provide the winner's name, city of residence, game won, date won and amount won to any third party who requests the information; however Florida Lottery winners' home addresses and telephone numbers are confidential." Source: http://www.flalottery.com/faq
The Florida Lottery allows trusts to claim it, however winner information is still released in compliance with the law. A $15 Million jackpot was claimed by an LLC. Source: https://www.fox13news.com/amp/consumehit-the-lottery-remain-anonymous-not-in-florida Source: http://flalottery.com/pressRelease?searchID=199128
Georgia: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner for all prizes over $250,000. Source: https://www.stl.news/georgia-governor-signs-bill-allowing-lottery-winners-remain-anonymous/121962/
Guam: Anonymity appears to be an option. Source: https://www.kuam.com/story/11218413/guamanian-wins-big-in-sportsbingo-but-has-yet-to-claim-2m-prize
Hawaii: No current lottery. Source: https://www.kitv.com/story/40182224/powerball-or-mega-millions-lottery-in-hawaii
Idaho: Not Anonymous."By claiming a winning lottery ticket over $600, winners become subject to Idaho’s Public Records Law. This means your “win” becomes an offcial Idaho public record. Your full name, the town where you live, the game you won, the amount you won (before and after taxes), the name of the retailer where you bought the ticket, and the amount the retailer receives for selling the ticket are all a matter of public record." Can seek anonymity if you have specific security concerns (rarely granted). Source: https://www.idaholottery.com/images/uploads/general/winnersguideweb.pdf
Illinois: Not Anonymous/Anonymous if requested by winner for all wins over $250,000 however info will be released to a FOIA request. "However, Murphy also cooperated with the Illinois Press Association in adding an amendment that ensures that Freedom of Information Act, an act designed to keep government agencies transparent by allowing the public to access any public record by request, supersedes the privacy law, according to attorney Don Craven, the press association’s legal counsel." Source: https://www.thetelegraph.com/news/article/Hidden-riches-Big-lottery-winner-in-Beardstown-13626173.php
Indiana: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via LLC or trust. "Indiana law allows lottery jackpot winners to remain anonymous, with the money being claimed by a limited liability company or legal trust." Source: https://www.chicagotribune.com/nation-world/ct-indiana-mega-millions-winners-20160729-story.html
Iowa: Not Anonymous/Can use a trust to claim but information will be released. "When you win an Iowa Lottery prize of $600 or more, you have to fill out a winner claim form that includes your name, address and Social Security number before you can claim your winnings. Iowa law makes the information on that claim form public, meaning that anyone can request a copy of the form to see who has won the prize. We redact sensitive information, such as your Social Security number, from the form before we release it, but all other details are considered public information under Iowa law (Iowa Code Section 99G.34(5)." Source: https://www.ialotteryblog.com/2008/11/can-prize-winne.html.
For group play, "Prizes can be paid to players who play as a group. A check can be written to an entity such as a trust or to a single individual." Source: https://ialottery.com/pages/Games/ClaimingPrizes.aspx
Kansas: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. "Kansas is one of a handful of states that does not have this requirement. If you win a prize in Kansas, you may request that your identity not be released publicly." Source: https://www.kslottery.com/faqs#faq-8
Kentucky: Anonymity appears to be an option. Anonymity or who can claim is not addressed on lottery website. But multiple instances of winners claiming anonymously have been reported in the news. "Kentucky Lottery spokesman Chip Polson said the $1 million Powerball winner claimed the prize on May 15 and the Mega Million winner claimed the prize on May 12. He confirmed that both players wanted their identity to remain a secret." Source: https://www.courier-journal.com/story/news/local/2017/05/19/two-1-million-lottery-winners-who-bought-tickets-louisville-want-privacy/101870414/
Louisiana: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via trust. "Under the Lottery's statute, all prize payment records are open records, meaning that the public has a right to request the information. Depending upon the amount won and public or media interest in the win, winners may NOT be able to remain anonymous. The statute also allows the Lottery to use winners' names and city of residence for publicity purposes such as news releases. The Lottery's regular practice is not to use winner information in paid advertising or product promotion without the winner's willingness to participate. Source: https://louisianalottery.com/faq/easy-5#35 Source: https://louisianalottery.com/article/1050/the-williams-trust-claims-share-of-50-million-powerball-jackpot
Maine: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via trust. "In the event that Maine does have a Mega Millions winner, he or she can opt to remain anonymous — but Boardman says that’s never happened. “What a winner could do in Maine is they could file their claim in the name of a trust, and the trust becomes the winner. So that’s how a winner could claim their ticket anonymously,” he says." Source: https://www.mainepublic.org/post/lottery-official-reminds-mainers-they-re-exceedingly-unlikely-win-16-billion-jackpot
Maryland*: Not Anonymous by Law, Anonymous in Practice. "However, the legal basis for this anonymity in Maryland is thin. The Maryland Lottery does not advertise that lottery winners may remain anonymous, but it posts articles on its website about winners and notes those winners who have “chosen to remain anonymous:” Source: https://www.gw-law.com/blog/anonymity-maryland-lottery-winners
*"Please note that this anonymity protection does not apply to second-chance and Points for Drawings contests run through the My Lottery Rewards program. Those contests are run as promotions for the Lottery. As such, they are operated under a different set of rules than our draw games and scratch-off games. The rules of participating in our second-chance and Points for Drawings contests state that winners' identities are published."" Source: https://www.mdlottery.com/about-us/faqs/
Massachusetts: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via trust "Lottery regulations state that a claimant's name, city or town, image, amount of prize, claim date and game are public record. Therefore, photographs may be taken and used to publicize winnings." Source: https://www.masslive.com/news/2018/05/lottery_sees_increase_in_winne.html
Michigan: Not Anonymous for Powerball and Mega Millions/100% Anonymous if requested by the winner for all other winners over $10,000. "Winner Anonymity. Michigan law requires written consent before disclosing the identity of the winner of $10,000 or more from the State lottery games Lotto47 and Fantasy 5. You further understand and agree that your identity may be disclosed, and that disclosure may be required, as the winner of any prize from the multi-state games Powerball and Mega Millions." Source: https://www.michiganlottery.com/games/mega-millions
Minnesota: Not Anonymous. Anonymity or who can claim is not addressed on lottery website but lottery blog states "In Minnesota, lottery winners cannot remain anonymous. A winner's name, city, prize amount won and the place that the winning ticket was sold is public data and will be released to media and posted on our website." Source: https://www.mnlottery.com/blog/you-won-now-what
Mississippi: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. "In accordance with the Alyce G. Clarke Mississippi Lottery Law, the Mississippi Lottery will not disclose the identity of the person holding a winning lottery ticket without that person's written permission." Source: https://www.mslotteryhome.com/players/faqs/
Missouri: Not Anonymous. "At the Lottery Headquarters, a member of the Lottery's communications staff will ask you questions about your win, such as how many tickets you bought, when you found out that you won and what you plan to do with your prize money. This information will be used for a news release. You will also be asked, but are not required, to participate in a news conference, most likely at the store where you purchased your winning ticket." Source: http://www.molottery.com/whenyouwin/jackpotwin.shtm
A Missouri State Legislator has submitted a bill to the State House to give lottery winners anonymity. Source: https://www.kfvs12.com/2020/02/25/mo-house-considers-legislation-protect-identity-lottery-winners/
Montana: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via trust. "In Montana, by law, certain information about lottery winners is considered public. That information includes: the winner's name, the amount won and the winner's community of residence. Winners may choose to claim as an individual or they may choose to form a trust and claim their prize as a trust. If a trust claims a lottery prize, the name of the trust is considered public information. A trust must have a federal tax identification number in order to claim a Montana Lottery prize." Source: https://www.montanalottery.com/en/view/about-faqs
Nebraska: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via LLC. Anonymity or who can claim is not addressed on lottery website but a winner created a legal entity to claim anonymously in 2014. "Nebraska Lottery spokesman Neil Watson said with the help of a Kearney lawyer, the winner or winners have created a legal entity called Carpe Diem LLC." Source: https://journalstar.com/news/state-and-regional/nebraska/m-nebraska-powerball-winner-to-remain-anonymous/article_a044d0f0-99a7-5302-bcb9-2ce799b3a798.html
A Nebraska State Legislator has now filed a bill to give 100% Anonymity to all winners over $300,000 who request it. Source: https://journalstar.com/news/state-and-regional/nebraska/anonymity-for-lottery-winners-bill-would-give-privacy-to-those/article_1cdba44d-c8bb-5971-b73f-2eecc8cd4625.html
Nevada: No current lottery. Source: https://www.reviewjournal.com/business/casinos-gaming/heres-why-you-cant-play-powerball-in-nevada/
New Hampshire: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via a trust. Anonymity or who can claim is not addressed on lottery website but a winner successfully sued the lottery and won the right to remain anonymous in 2018. Source: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2018/03/12/winner-of-a-560-million-powerball-jackpot-can-keep-the-money-and-her-secret-judge-rules/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.bec2db2f7d2c
New Jersey: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://www.nj.com/politics/2020/01/win-big-you-can-claim-those-nj-lottery-winnings-anonymously-under-new-law.html
New Mexico: Not Anonymous. “Winners of $10,000 or more will have name, city, game played, and prize amount and photo on website.” Can seek anonymity if you have specific security concerns (rarely granted). Source: https://www.nmlottery.com/uploads/FileLinks/82400d81a0ce468daab29ebe6db3ec27/Winner_Publicity_Policy_6_1_07.pdf
New York: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via a LLC. Anonymity or who can claim is not addressed on lottery website but per Gov. Cuomo: "For the past 40 years, individuals wishing to keep their name and information out of the public view have created LLCs to collect their winnings for them." Source: https://nypost.com/2018/12/09/cuomo-vetoes-bill-allowing-lotto-winners-to-remain-anonymous/
North Carolina: Not Anonymous. "North Carolina law allows lottery winners' identity to remain confidential only if they have an active protective order against someone or participate in the state's "Address Confidentiality Program" for victims of domestic violence, sexual offense, stalking or human trafficking." Source: https://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/local/article54548645.html
North Dakota: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://www.kfyrtv.com/home/headlines/ND-Powerball-Winners-Have-Option-to-Remain-Anonymous-364918121.html
Northern Mariana Islands: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://www.nmsalottery.com/game-rules/
Ohio: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via trust. Anonymity or who can claim is not addressed on lottery website but appears to have an anonymous option. "The procedure from there was a little cumbersome. I needed to create two separate trusts. One trust was to appoint me, as the trustee on behalf of the winner, to contact the Lottery Commission and accept the Lottery winnings. The secondary trust was set up for me as trustee of the first trust, to transfer the proceeds to the second trust with the winner as the beneficiary. This enabled me to present the ticket, accept the proceeds, and transfer it to the winner with no public record or disclosure." Source: https://www.altickcorwin.com/Articles/How-To-Claim-Lottery-Winnings-Anonymously.shtml
Oklahoma: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via trust or LLC. In accordance with the Oklahoma Open Records Act and the Oklahoma Education Lottery Act, the name of any individual, corporation, partnership, unincorporated association, limited liability company, or other legal entity, and their city of residence will be made public. Source: https://www.lottery.ok.gov/playersclub/faq.asp Source: https://oklahoman.com/article/5596678/lottery-winners-deserve-some-anonymity
Oregon: Not Anonymous. "No. Certain information about Lottery prizes is public record, including the name of the winner, amount of the prize, date of the drawing, name of the game played and city in which the winning ticket was purchased. Oregon citizens have a right to know that Lottery prizes are indeed being awarded to real persons. " Source: https://oregonlottery.org/about/public-interaction/commission-directofrequently-asked-questions Can seek anonymity if you have specific security concerns (rarely granted). Source: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3353432/Man-living-Iraq-wins-6-4-million-Oregon-jackpot.html
Pennsylvania: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via trust. Source: https://lancasteronline.com/news/local/trust-that-won-powerball-no-relation-to-manheim-township-emerald/article_29834922-4ca2-11e8-baac-1b15a17f3e9c.html
Puerto Rico: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/puerto-rico-powerball-winner-claims-prize-chooses-stay-anonymous-n309121
Rhode Island: Not Anonymous/Anonymous if requested but all info is subject to FOIA. "While the Lottery will do everything possible to keep a winner's information private if requested by the winner, in Rhode Island and most other states, this information falls under the Freedom of Information Act, and a winner's name and city or town of residency must be released upon request." Source: https://www.rilot.com/en-us/player-zone/faqs.html
South Carolina: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Anonymity or who can claim is not addressed on lottery website but appears to have an anonymous option based on prior winners. Source: https://myfox8.com/2019/03/15/the-anonymous-south-carolina-winner-of-the-largest-lottery-jackpot-is-donating-part-of-it-to-alabama-tornado-victims/
South Dakota: Not Anonymous for draw games and online games/100% Anonymous for Scratchoffs if requested by the winner. "You can remain anonymous on any amount won from a scratch ticket game. Jackpots for online games are required to be public knowledge. Play It Again winners are also public knowledge." Source: https://lottery.sd.gov/FAQ2018/gamefaq.aspx.
Tennessee: Not Anonymous/Can use a trust but info subject to open records act. Anonymity is explicitly noted as not being allowed on the official lottery website. Source: https://www.tnlottery.com/faq/i-won
However if it is claimed via a trust then the lottery will not give out your information unless requested to do so. "The TN lottery says: "When claiming a Lottery prize through a Trust, the TN Lottery would need identity documentation for the grantor and all ultimate beneficiaries. Once we are in possession of these documents and information, records are generated. If a formal request is made by a citizen of Tennessee, the Trust beneficiary's name, city and state must be made available under the Tennessee Open Records Act." Source: https://www.avvo.com/legal-answers/in-tennessee--can-a-lottery-jackpot-be-claimed-whi-2327592.html
Texas: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner for $1 million or more IF the winner claims it as an individual AND chooses the Cash option. Not Anonymous if claimed by a trust or LLC or if the winner chooses the Annuity option. Source: https://www.txlottery.org/export/sites/lottery/Documents/retailers/FAQ_Winner_Anonymity_12112017_final.pdf
Utah: No current lottery. Source: https://www.lotterycritic.com/lottery-results/utah/
Vermont: Not Anonymous/Anonymous via trust. “The name, town and prize amount on your Claim Form is public information. If you put your name on the Claim Form, your name becomes public information. If you claim your prize in a trust, the name of the trust is placed on the Claim Form, and the name of the trust is public information.” Source: https://vtlottery.com/about/faq
Virginia: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner for prizes over $10 million. "A new law passed by the Virginia General Assembly and signed by the Governor prohibits the Virginia Lottery from disclosing information about big jackpot winners." "When the bill goes into effect this summer, the Virginia Lottery will not be allowed to release certain information about winners whose prize exceeds $10 million, unless the winner wants to be known." Source: https://www.13newsnow.com/article/news/local/virginia/new-virginia-law-allows-certain-lottery-winners-to-keep-identity-private/291-c33ea642-e8fa-45fd-b3a4-dc693cf5b372
US Virgin Islands: Anonymity appears to be an option. A $2 Million Powerball winner was allowed to remain anonymous. Source: https://viconsortium.com/virgin-islands-2/st-croix-resident-wins-2-million-in-latest-power-ball-drawing/
Washington: Not Anonymous/Can use a trust but info subject to open records act. "As a public agency, all documents held by Washington's Lottery are subject to the Public Records Act. Lottery prizes may be claimed in the name of a legally formed entity, such as a trust. However, in the event of a public records request, the documents forming the artificial entity may be released, thereby revealing the individual names of winners." https://www.walottery.com/ClaimYourPrize/
West Virginia: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner for prizes over $1 million and 5% of winnings remittance. "Effective January 1, 2019, House Bill 2982 allows winners of State Lottery draw games to remain anonymous in regards to his or her name, personal contact information, and likeness; providing that the prize exceeds one million dollars and the individual who elects to remain anonymous remits five percent of his or her winnings to the State Lottery Fund." Source: https://wvlottery.com/customer-service/customer-resources/
Wisconsin: Not Anonymous/Cannot be claimed by other entities. "Pursuant to Wisconsin’s Open Records law (Wis. Stats. Secs. 19.31–19.39), the Lottery is required to disclose a winner’s name, likeness and place of residence. If you win and claim a prize, the Lottery may use your name, likeness and place of residence for any purpose without compensation to you.
Upon claiming your prize, you waive any claims against the Lottery and its representatives for any and all liability which may result from the disclosure or use of such information." "The original winning ticket must be signed by a single human being. For-profit and non-profit entities, trusts, and other non-human beings are not eligible to play or claim a prize." Source: https://wilottery.com/claimprize.aspx
Wyoming: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. "We will honor requests for anonymity from winners. However, we certainly hope winners will allow us to share their names and good news with other players." Source: https://wyolotto.com/lottery/faq/
Other countries
Australia: 100% Anonymous if requested by winner. "The great thing about playing lotto in Australia is that winners can choose to remain anonymous and keep their privacy, unlike in the United States where winners don't have such a choice, and are often thrown into a media circus." Source: https://www.ozlotteries.com/blog/how-to-remain-anonymous-when-you-win-lotto/
Bahamas: No current lottery. Source: https://thenassauguardian.com/2013/01/29/strong-no-vote-trend-so-far-in-gaming-referendum/
Barbados: Not Anonymous. "No. Barbados Lottery winners cannot remain anonymous. The Barbados Lottery mandates the winner’s name, address, game won, date won and amount won be provided; however Barbados Lottery winners' home addresses and telephone numbers are confidential." Source: https://www.mybarbadoslottery.com/faqs
Brazil: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://www.lotterycritic.com/lottery-results/brazil-lottery/
Canada: Not Anonymous. Every provincial lottery corporation in Canada requires winners to participate in a publicity photo shoot showing their face, their name and their municipality. Can seek anonymity if you have specific security concerns (rarely granted). Source: https://consumers.findlaw.ca/article/can-lottery-winners-remain-anonymous/
Carribbean Lottery Countries (Antigua/Barbuda, Anguilla, St. Kitts/Nevis, St. Maarten/Saba/St. Eustatius, and Turks/Caicos): Not Anonymous. "No. Caribbean Lottery winners cannot remain anonymous. The Caribbean Lottery mandates the winner’s name, address, game won, date won and amount won be provided; however Caribbean Lottery winners' home addresses and telephone numbers are confidential." Source: https://www.thecaribbeanlottery.com/faqs
China: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Must appear in a press conference and photo but allowed to wear disguise. Source: https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2015/01/22/china-lottery-winners-mask/22108515/
Cuba: No current lottery. Source: https://oncubanews.com/en/cuba/society-cuba/cuban-traditions/lottery-the-national-game-infographics/
EuroMillions Countries (Austria, Belgium, France, Ireland, Luxembourg, Portugal, Spain, Switzerland, and UK*): 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://www.euro-millions.com/publicity
*United Kingdom: Excludes
*Caymen Islands, and Falkland Islands: No current lottery. Source: https://calvinayre.com/2018/11/02/business/cayman-islands-move-illegal-gambling-doesnt-address-real-issue/ Source: https://simonsblogpark.com/onlinegambling/simons-guide-gambling-falkland-islands/amp/#lottery-falkland-islands
*Anguilla, and Turks & Caicos: Not Anonymous. Source: https://www.thecaribbeanlottery.com/faqs
EuroJackpot Countries (Croatia, Czechia, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, Germany, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Netherlands*, Norway, Poland, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, and Sweden): 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://www.euro-jackpot.net/en/publicity
*Netherlands: Excludes
*St. Maarten, Saba, and St. Eustatius: Not Anonymous. Source: https://www.thecaribbeanlottery.com/faqs
Fiji: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://fijisun.com.fj/2012/11/08/3m-lotto-win-here/
Georgia (Kartvelia): Anonymity appears to be an option. "2.9.1. Prizes and Winners. Each Bidder shall provide details of:....how winners who waive their right to privacy will be treated;" Source: https://mof.ge/images/File/lottery/tender-documentation.pdf
Guyana: Not Anonymous. Source: https://www.kaieteurnewsonline.com/2013/05/16/winner-says-he-was-too-busy-to-collect-78m-lotto-prize/
India*: Not Anonymous. Source: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-35771298
*: Only available in the states of Kerala, Goa, Maharashtra, Madhya Pradesh, Punjab, West Bengal, Assam, Arunachal Pradesh, Meghalaya, Manipur, Sikkim, Nagaland and Mizoram. Source: https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/lottery-mizoram-nagaland-sikkim-kerala-975188-2017-05-04
Indonesia: No current lottery. Source: https://apnews.com/45eb94ff1b1132470a7aa5902f0bc734
Israel: Not Anonymous by Law, Anonymous in Practice. “[A]lthough we have this right, we have never exercised it because we understood the difficulties the winners could encounter in the period after their win. We provide details about the winner, but in a manner that doesn’t disclose their identity,” Dolin Melnik, then-spokesperson for Israel’s Mifal Hapayis lottery told Haaretz in 2009." Source: https://www.timesofisrael.com/why-the-israeli-lottery-gives-winners-masks/
Jamaica: Not Anonymous. First initial and last name of winner was released but winner was allowed to wear a mask for photo. Source: https://news.e-servicis.com/news/trending/lottery-winner-takes-prize-in-scream-mask.1S/
Japan: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/09/08/business/japans-lottery-rakes-declining-revenues-younger-generation-gives-jackpot-chances-pass/#.XRYwVVMpCdM
Kenya: Not Anonymous. "9.1 When You claim or are paid a prize, You will automatically be deemed to grant to O8 LOTTO an irrevocable right to publish, through all types of media broadcasting, including the internet, for the purposes of promoting the win, Your full name (as well as Your nick name), hometown, photograph and video materials without any claim for broadcasting, printing or other rights" Source: https://mylottokenya.co.ke/terms-conditions
Malaysia: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://says.com/my/news/a-24-year-old-malaysian-woman-just-won-more-than-rm4-million-from-4d-lottery
Nagorno-Karabakh: Not Anonymous. Source: http://asbarez.com/120737/artsakh-lottery-winner-claims-car-prize/
New Zealand: 100% Anonymous if requested by winner. Source: https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10383080
North Korea: Not Anonymous. Source: https://www.nknews.org/2018/11/north-korean-sports-ministry-launches-online-lottery/
Northern Cyprus: Anonymity appears to be an option. Source: https://www.pressreader.com/cyprus/cyprus-today/20181124/281590946615912
Oman: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: http://www.omanlottery.com/
Philippines: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://www.rappler.com/nation/214995-ultra-lotto-winners-claim-winnings-pcso-october-2018
Romania: Anonymity appears to be an option. Source: https://www.thelotter.com/win-lottery-anonymously/
Russia: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: http://siberiantimes.com/otheothers/news/siberian-scoops-a-record-184513512-roubles-on-russian-state-lottery/
Samoa: Not Anonymous. Source: https://www.rnz.co.nz/international/pacific-news/191796/samoa%27s-lotto-winner-still-a-mystery
Saudi Arabia: No current lottery. Source: https://www.arabnews.com/police-arrest-lottery-crooks-victimizing-expats
Singapore: Anonymity appears to be an option. Source: https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/did-you-win-here-are-results-of-136m-toto-hongbao-draw
Solomon Islands: No current lottery. Source: http://www.paclii.org/sb/legis/consol_act/gala196/
South Africa: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://www.thesouthafrican.com/powerball-results/powerball-winner-r232-million-found-lottery-details/
South Korea: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: https://elaw.klri.re.keng_mobile/viewer.do?hseq=38378&type=sogan&key=5
Sri Lanka: Anonymity appears to be an option. Source: http://www.thesundayleader.lk/2010/01/31/where-do-all-the-lottery-winners-go/
Taiwan: 100% Anonymous if requested by the winner. Source: http://m.focustaiwan.tw/news/asoc/201806250011.aspx
Trinidad and Tobago: Anonymity appears to be an option. Source: https://trinidadexpress.com/news/local/student-wins-the-million-lotto/article_3f3c8550-570d-11e9-9cc3-b7550f9b4ad4.html
Tuvalu: No current lottery. Source: http://tuvalu-legislation.tv/cms/images/LEGISLATION/PRINCIPAL/1964/1964-0004/GamingandLotteries_1.pdf
United Arab Emirates: Not Anonymous. Source: https://www.ndtv.com/indians-abroad/shojith-ks-in-sharjah-uae-wins-abu-dhabi-duty-free-big-ticket-4-million-jackpot-rejects-calls-2032942
Vatican City: Anonymity appears to be an option. Source: https://cruxnow.com/vatican/2018/12/04/popes-white-lamborghini-up-for-raffle-winner-gets-trip-to-rome/
Vietnam: Anonymity appears to be an option. Source: https://ampe.vnexpress.net/news/news/vietnamese-farmer-identified-as-winner-of-4-million-lottery-jackpot-3484751.html
Windward Lottery Countries (Dominica, Grenada, Saint Lucia, Saint Vincent and the Grenadines): Not Anonymous. "Prize winners asked to do so by Winlot must give their name and address, and satisfactory establish their identity. All winners of the Jackpot (Match 6) prize will be photographed. Note that Winlot and CBN reserve the right to publish the names, addresses and photographs of all the winners." Source: http://www.stlucialotto.com/snl/super6_rules_regs.php
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